Eagle unbalanced

[greenjacket124]

Can you add arguments to your claim?

Yea, that's easy enough. Eagles and bears have high appeal, so your opponent having multiple got them a lot of points. But, again, not because a single one is overpowered.

I beg to differ, having an extra turn is always very powerful especially when the last round is triggered. Having even more additional turns pushes this even higher. In a mostly balanced game where both players ramp up at the same speed, the one with a more powerful (due to animals + association) has a big advantage to gain more points at once.

Other animals have even higher appeal or other bonuses like reputation or points, but the extra turns exceed those.

If you find a replay where two players with the same skill level play and the one without extra turns easily wins,I would be happy to rethink my assumption.

If they are not overpowered, would you even debate the tier lists for the cards that are well known?

Are they powerful? Of course they are. Are they overpowered? No, not at all.

[boardgamesmue]

Yea, that's easy enough. Eagles and bears have high appeal, so your opponent having multiple got them a lot of points. But, again, not because a single one is overpowered.

I beg to differ, having an extra turn is always very powerful especially when the last round is triggered. Having even more additional turns pushes this even higher. In a mostly balanced game where both players ramp up at the same speed, the one with a more powerful (due to animals + association) has a big advantage to gain more points at once.

Other animals have even higher appeal or other bonuses like reputation or points, but the extra turns exceed those.

If you find a replay where two players with the same skill level play and the one without extra turns easily wins,I would be happy to rethink my assumption.

If they are not overpowered, would you even debate the tier lists for the cards that are well known?

Are they powerful? Of course they are. Are they overpowered? No, not at all.

So what cards do have the same power level like those that let you do extra turns (including the bear to do additional association)?
Name some including examples why.

[Azoken]

Archeologist range from okay to broken, depending on the Map.

And i'd give you both eagles to land a side entrance on the first turn.

Cards giving you a free action are (very) good but they need both money and a set up.

[boardgamesmue]

Archeologist range from okay to broken, depending on the Map.

Yes but very dependent on the map and not great in the endgame.

And i'd give you both eagles to land a side entrance on the first turn.

Side entrance is an advantage in early game, but not as strong as extra turns in the late game.

Cards giving you a free action are (very) good but they need both money and a set up.

The money shouldn't be an issue in the late game, same with the upgraded card. Most of the setup will be there naturally. So I would oppose that argument of making them less powerful.

[MrMaymay]

Its overpowered, if you already have everything setup already.
Aviary build (which you build for your other 2-3 birds), lots of income/money left, Something strong to play in your extra turn and you didnt waste a draw turn, just to grab the eagle.

But the same way I'd argue that Posturing is an OP mechanic, since you could last turn play 2 animals and finish your zoo and get all the extra points from your endcard/sponsors.

If you draw the eagles in your starting hand, you play basicly with -1 card for a very long time, thats enough of a punishment.

But like others already set. Its a flashy card. If you lose against it, you will always say its because of the OP eagle.

[Robofrogg]

Keeping both sunbear and eagle in starting hand is pretty risky. Those cards are both unplayable at the start of the game and pretty low impact even when played earlier in the game as well....so your hand is basically clogged up with 2 cards until close to the end of the game. Not good. Not impossible to win doing it, but not the cakewalk you might think it is, either.

[CharlesRDarwin]

I think they are two of the strongest animals in the game, but I don't think they are too far ahead of some others; rhino's are also strong. Additionally, eagles are only really strong at the end of the game, especially if you already have an aviary. In terms of cards I'd want in my starting four, if birds wasn't a project that game, there are lots of cards I'd rather have.

[Mongoose01ca]

I would love for a play mode that removes Eagles, Sun Bear, and Side Entrance from the game. They warp the two most important phases of the game - the very beginning and the very end. Nobody with any skill is playing their eagles outside of the last turn (to make that NOT the last turn, which is basically and end run around the 'person who triggers the end of the game doesn't get another turn' rule), and a SE early on just makes the game unfun. I've beaten both, but it took extreme luck on my end to pull it off. Most of the time that doesn't happen.

I'm an old guy, so I remember playing against Moxen in MtG and it's the same argument from those who don't think they're OP: "It's one card, you have to plan around it, there are counters, blah blah blah". Nonsense. These cards are severely undercosted for the abilities they provide, and should either be massively edited (personally I like putting a 50 point max limit on the Eagles, like the 25 point sponsors, and SE should cost 6, not 3) or simply removed so that we can enjoy the rest of this amazing game...

If you think they are fine and dandy that's great - if enough feel that way then keep Arena with that ruleset. But at least give casual players a chance to play without them.

[greenjacket124]

I would love for a play mode that removes Eagles, Sun Bear, and Side Entrance from the game.

You're welcome to do that at your in-person table, but we are not able to implement custom rulesets that the publisher has not approved.