What a hell is up with the interface?

[morphles]

Interface keeps changing, some times a bit for a better but seems last change for worse. Most importan thing for me is hiddend (and it always was...). How do I see my tables? That is tables that I'm present, be it in game or waiting? Such a feature should be accessible with a single click... Now I mange to get to "YOUR GAMES IN PROGRESS" not in a convinient thay though... But yesterday I started a table and invited some friends, some of them haven't been online for quite some time. So I wanted to check if they joined in. But I see no way to find that table...

[sourisdudesert]

Well, there is no table at now where this is your turn to play, so we don't bother you with any information and you have to go to "games in progress" to see them. We didn't change that from years.

When it's your turn to play, there is a big banner on top, just below the menu, with "It's your turn to play on X tables". We moved it to the right column recently, but a lot of you complained here, we decided to listen to them and put it back to the top. It's even larger than before so you cannot miss it.

[morphles]

I liked it to the side more though, since it does not "dynamicly push content down" when it figures out there are tables where it's my turn. But that's a minor thing.

As for "do not bother", I do not think this is appropriate. Listing all tables where player is sitting (in whatever satage) seems like a sensible thing to do. Also as I said, table with my "Waiting game" (where not all players confirmed participation) was not listed in games in progress. But I think some time previously it used to list such games?

[morphles]

Just a minor point: games in progress seems like important enough item to be in main menu.

Another thing, why the hell I can not see player information from game? There name does not link to profile... I have to go in roundabout ways to reach "games in progres" (no really that page is just very inconvinient to reach) and only there can I click on nick to see player information...

[sourisdudesert]

I agree that there are improvements to be made, for ex to get players profile from game, or to prioritize tables where you are in over others in turn-based lobby.

For games in progress, this would be difficult to have it in current main menu. And honestly, when it's not your turn to play, you have very few reasons to use this page.

[turtler7]

I believe both of the features you are looking for to be fairly easy to use but are perhaps not clearly marked. I hope this summary will help you master the interface as this site has a great system but just needs understanding to operate.

Everything to do with games is under the "PLAY NOW" heading bar. When you click on that it has three sub-menus labeled "play in realtime", "play turn based", and "watch games in progress".

Play in realtime is how you find tables to join that will have an immediate play till completion. Once you join or make a real-time table a convenient "you have joined X table" will appear at the top of your interface on all tabs so it is always easy to jump back to the game waiting for players in realtime if you were to check other pages.

Play turn based is where all games that have not yet started are found. It sorts them with games you have actively listed as wanting to play at the top and all various games being setup available on the site can be found by further down the same page. If you are trying to find a game that has no open seats or restrictions you do not qualify for you will need to click on "display tables I can't join" to see the entire list. If you have created a game and invited people and that game is in your current want to play list you should go to play turn based and expand to show tables I can't join then use your browsers search function (ctrl+f or command+f) and type in your name so you can jump directly to the ones you are interested in and can then click on that game to open the table and be able to manage the players.

Watch games in progress is where your currently running games are listed regardless of if it is your turn or not. It does not display any games of which you are not a part so some people find that name misleading.

[morphles]

I'll just note that I have used this site for quite some time, probably 3 years or so, even considered programming game for it (got the api downloaded looked at it for a bit) but that got nowhere. So I kinda know the interface. While I appreaciate you spending time writing all that. My point is that for me it seems this is not a good setup. Compare game area to forum are, which I believe is phpbb (well stock phpbb anyway, as here clicking forum username takes to player profile (some irony right there, player profile from forum, but not from game)), in forum you can "view user posts" which lists all post by the user, and it is crazy good feature. Not sure why not having at least "all my tables" (not even viewing tables for any user) is acceptible in any way...

Also I minor note: I kinda mostly do not care about realtime play, so that might be skewing how I view the interface. But considering the numbers of turn based games, they are quite popular too...

[Liallan]

I'll just note that I have used this site for quite some time, probably 3 years or so, even considered programming game for it (got the api downloaded looked at it for a bit) but that got nowhere. So I kinda know the interface. While I appreaciate you spending time writing all that. My point is that for me it seems this is not a good setup. Compare game area to forum are, which I believe is phpbb (well stock phpbb anyway, as here clicking forum username takes to player profile (some irony right there, player profile from forum, but not from game)), in forum you can "view user posts" which lists all post by the user, and it is crazy good feature. Not sure why not having at least "all my tables" (not even viewing tables for any user) is acceptible in any way...

Also I minor note: I kinda mostly do not care about realtime play, so that might be skewing how I view the interface. But considering the numbers of turn based games, they are quite popular too...

I'm going to take a crack at this...

Your first post mentioned that "things keep changing." (And sorry, but you also sound like you don't know the site very well.) The place where you can see your games in progress, regardless if you have turns or not, has not moved anywhere in the 3 years I have been here. The only thing they have recently done is add the word "watch" in front of "games in progress." It's not intuitive, but it hasn't moved anywhere. If you could find it before, you can find it now. Furthermore, it is not that difficult to get to it. It requires one extra click, because you have to go to "Play Now" first. But other than that, it's no more difficult to get to than the yellow bar.

And it's a cool feature because all games are listed there, whether or not you have a turn up. Meaning it's a good thing to always have open unless you don't care about any game where you don't have a turn. I disagree with Sourisdudesert about that, because players have plenty of reasons for wanting to see their games even when no turn is up. I can name quite a few reasons, and I know I am not the only one because I've seen others talking about this. This seems to include you, but this does already exist, if you can tolerate one extra click.

If you really think that everything can be available with one single click from the same page, I think you have unrealistic expectations. Just imagine all the different things available under all the menus, and if they tried to find a way to make all of it available in one click from a single home page -- that would be so terribly confusing. You need to consider not everyone is going the exact same place you are. You personally might think it's "important enough" to warrant a single click, but a different person could consider something else "important enough" that you don't.

And you can see the tables you have opened yourself and invited people to. They are in the list with the other invitations. However, turtler7 is incorrect about having to click on the games you can't play. They will be under the normal list of games. If it's been a few days, they'll likely be at/near the bottom. Granted, it would be nice if they were "stickied" to the top of that list, but I don't see any reason they should be in "games in progress" because they aren't in progress. That would be counter-intuitive.

As to getting to profiles from within the game, that's been added and is in the latest News post.

Also, I too mostly only play turn-based and don't care much about real time, so I don't think that is what is skewing how you view the interface. It's the same way I view it.

[morphles]

I said I know all this. And I said interface is quite suboptimal. That you are used to it does not mean it is good. That why word changes threw me off.
Watch games in progres to see my games? WHAT A HELL? This is just stupid wording. I'm not native english speaker, but I can see this is not a good wording. I know that staff here are mostly not native english speakers ether, this most likely explains such wording choices. Like this "watch games in progress", to see YOUR GAMES that you are taking part, you are taking part in them => it is not watching! Watching is passive, if I'm playing I'm not watching, why would I go looking for my games in the area that sounds passive?
The point is that interface is quite confusing, due poor spliting in section, and even poorer naming of those sections. Here are my suggestions of how to make it much more straightforward (also that thing about fitting everytihg in menu? are you kidding me? I'm not 5).
Main menu starts like this:
My tables/games - lists everything involving me, games I'm in, tables waiting for start where I'm sitting. If I want something to do with my table such should be accessible immediatly. Maybe there is some multiplayer turn based game I want to check up, maybe something else. Could be bolded when you have games where it is your turn, possibly indicating number of active games in brackets, with my turn games over slash like "(4/2)". But of course with that top bar such additional things might not be 100% neccessary.
Play now - tables open for joining, with various categorization options, by game, by type (best would be checkboxes, so you could list all real time and turn based) turn based/real time.

Thats all other things(News, etc..), can follow these two main functions of the site. Thats my, rather not so humble, suggestion.

[Liallan]

Watch games in progres to see my games? WHAT A HELL? This is just stupid wording. I'm not native english speaker, but I can see this is not a good wording. I know that staff here are mostly not native english speakers ether, this most likely explains such wording choices. Like this "watch games in progress", to see YOUR GAMES that you are taking part, you are taking part in them => it is not watching! Watching is passive, if I'm playing I'm not watching, why would I go looking for my games in the area that sounds passive?

There are already two threads talking about this. I was addressing the part where you talked about things "changing," and the change is the name, but it hasn't moved. And I was addressing that it was "difficult to get to." I already posted about changing the name to include "watch" and the subject title even says so. I'm not arguing with you about the word "watch" being inappropriate.

(also that thing about fitting everytihg in menu? are you kidding me? I'm not 5).

The point of that was not so that I could be patronizing. You said this was "important enough" to warrant a single click, and my point was that other people think other things are "important enough." Once everyone gets their way, there's too many things that have to be a single-click and that's too much stuff. I think you are not considering that. But I already made this point, so you'll probably continue to believe I think you're 5 - go right ahead, I can't help that.

I don't really care whether it's one click or two, but I do think there's better stuff they could spend their time on.

Play now - tables open for joining, with various categorization options, by game, by type (best would be checkboxes, so you could list all real time and turn based) turn based/real time.

They had the real time and turn based all in one place once and it confused everyone, even though it was color-coded. It was eventually separated into two different lists to make it easier to see what is what, and I think it's better off staying that way. "Splitting" certain things is not always a bad thing. In fact, many people want separate "I want to play" lists for real time and turn based, so combining those back together would make that impossible. As to filters, which is what you seem to be getting at, that has already been requested. They took one step in that direction by at least separating out things we "can't" take that were clogging up the list, which was actually a great step. Further steps may be forthcoming.

That you find "games in progress" to be more important than invitations, is definitely a skewed vision of it. I couldn't care less what order those are in, as long as I know where they are and my games aren't hidden in some obscure place. (Which they are not. You just don't want to click one extra time.)