Please please can we have some option to nerf Hali B???

[laggercat]

I disagree that Hali B is OP in the classical edition. It is only strong against incompetent opponents, competent opponents destroy it quite well.

The data from the strongest tournament we had for old edition says otherwise. It was the best wonder in average place and in the 1st place percentage and in the lowest last place percentage.

In a way, against competent opponents it might be easier to play with Babylon B, which is perceived as weak by many.

The data places Babylon B lower, I personally like the wonder.

Could you please share these data sets? Thanks.

If someone can provide names of 5 players who only play 1st edition them I will put data together.

[laggercat]

I disagree that Hali B is OP in the classical edition. It is only strong against incompetent opponents, competent opponents destroy it quite well.

The data from the strongest tournament we had for old edition says otherwise. It was the best wonder in average place and in the 1st place percentage and in the lowest last place percentage.

In a way, against competent opponents it might be easier to play with Babylon B, which is perceived as weak by many.

The data places Babylon B lower, I personally like the wonder.

Could you please share these data sets? Thanks.

I have posted up in a new thread some stats from first edition games. The best performing wonder is either Rhodes B or Hali B, with a stronger case for Rhodes B.

The caveat here is that the top players don't play with first edition anymore. The average ELO for these results is around 230, compared to around 380 for the results I've posted for second edition.

[6element]

The caveat here is that the top players don't play with first edition anymore.

Seriously?

[laggercat]

The caveat here is that the top players don't play with first edition anymore.

Seriously?

Fair point. I looked at four player games only and the comment was in that context. If you are aware of a top player who regularly plays a four player with 1st edition then let me know - I couldn't find any.

[ExaltedAngel]

What do you guys think of an unofficial variant in which you choose the wonders by auction at the start of the game? You could bid negative victory points. I think that would balance the wonders and also the luck factor of having the right or wrong neighbours.

[Lumin_S]

Thanks laggercat for the update.

While I played plenty of New Edition in the past, I am now only playing Old Edition since (and have been since Dec 6 2021 according to my games history,) and have maintained a pretty solid rating for a long time. Definitely all my games before September (9th?) 2020 are Old Edition even if they are mistakenly labeled as New by BGA.

I'm definitely not suggesting you do any more work, but if you wanted to, then date restricting which games you look at would be a surefire way to isolate Old Edition.