Cheating

[davidr0607]

...BGA have failed to take into account different time zones...

What could be done about different time zones in your opinion? There's the option to set a playing day-time for a tournament. That's up to the tournament creator and it's the participants duty to check if that fits for them before they enter. When no daytime is set then you should only join tournaments if either there are many days of thinking time or you are available to play more than half of the day every day in a 2-player tournament to have a guaranteed overlap in time. If you can't ensure that then you shouldn't sign up. There is no technical solution for availability of each user during the day and I can't think of anything that could solve that. Sleeping during tournament start is no excuse. The other player will also sleep at some point and lose time then.

Yes it's shitty behaviour to not make your last move when you are available and realizing it's your turn. But you don't know if that is the case or if they were just shown online because they forgot to switch off their computer when they went to bed. Or they had a lot of other games going on and didn't find their way back to yours yet. BGA can only solve this on a technical level and that is judging by the fact that you over-exhausted your thinking time - which would never happen if you'd only sign up to tournaments where you can guarantee enough availability.

As some who has worked as a computer programmer, I can think of lots of ways to solve it.
First of all, if a game score is calculated as you play rather than at the end, you award the player who is winning. This would be an easy fix as I have no doubt there is a field in the program that records when this is done and then you would just have to add an "if...then...else" statement into the subroutine that decides the winner. Easy.
Second, the program knows what time it is where you are so why not simply stop the playing clock counting down between the hours of say Midnight to 6am. This would make it a lot harder for people to cheat they way this person did.
Very simple solution but BGA programmers are either not smart enough to think to them or they don't care. I'm guessing the later.

In the case here, it was still afternoon where they were when I made my last mode they they definitely weren't in bed. When I messaged then they lied and said it was night. So it was definitely deliberate.

[frankenStain]

I was leading 26-12 in a Martian dice tournament (need 25 to win) and the cheating opponent waits out the time and wins on time. She has no hope of winning. How is this allowed? I live in Australia so slept through the start of the match. That is the only reason I "lost". This is a joke. Was thinking of going Premium but not going to do that on a system that allows cheaters to prosper.

And how is cheating in any way ? Would a chess player say the other is cheating if he lose over time, even if he had a better position ?? That's just the rules of the game you accepted to play. Try other format if this one does not suit you.

How is it not cheating? If you go "I can't win this game properly so I will wait until times runs out and win by default" that is straight up cheating. You are taking advantage of a crazy system that doesn't award the player who is winning. In chess, you would get a draw, not a lose. And believe me I won't be entering anymore tournaments run by Sheffield_refugee as he seems to condone cheating.

It is sadly a part of the meta in competitive play, sorry man...

[frankenStain]

...BGA have failed to take into account different time zones...

What could be done about different time zones in your opinion? There's the option to set a playing day-time for a tournament. That's up to the tournament creator and it's the participants duty to check if that fits for them before they enter. When no daytime is set then you should only join tournaments if either there are many days of thinking time or you are available to play more than half of the day every day in a 2-player tournament to have a guaranteed overlap in time. If you can't ensure that then you shouldn't sign up. There is no technical solution for availability of each user during the day and I can't think of anything that could solve that. Sleeping during tournament start is no excuse. The other player will also sleep at some point and lose time then.

Yes it's shitty behaviour to not make your last move when you are available and realizing it's your turn. But you don't know if that is the case or if they were just shown online because they forgot to switch off their computer when they went to bed. Or they had a lot of other games going on and didn't find their way back to yours yet. BGA can only solve this on a technical level and that is judging by the fact that you over-exhausted your thinking time - which would never happen if you'd only sign up to tournaments where you can guarantee enough availability.

As some who has worked as a computer programmer, I can think of lots of ways to solve it.
First of all, if a game score is calculated as you play rather than at the end, you award the player who is winning. This would be an easy fix as I have no doubt there is a field in the program that records when this is done and then you would just have to add an "if...then...else" statement into the subroutine that decides the winner. Easy.
Second, the program knows what time it is where you are so why not simply stop the playing clock counting down between the hours of say Midnight to 6am. This would make it a lot harder for people to cheat they way this person did.
Very simple solution but BGA programmers are either not smart enough to think to them or they don't care. I'm guessing the later.

In the case here, it was still afternoon where they were when I made my last mode they they definitely weren't in bed. When I messaged then they lied and said it was night. So it was definitely deliberate.

btw you made your point that you played with a shitty person .

your 1st solution doesnt work because you would just get the lead, and then let your time run out - or maybe I didnt got your idea
your 2nd solution is implemented - there are optional playing hours (in tournaments at least) and non optional ones in arena, I think (dont quote me on the second one)

[davidr0607]

What could be done about different time zones in your opinion? There's the option to set a playing day-time for a tournament. That's up to the tournament creator and it's the participants duty to check if that fits for them before they enter. When no daytime is set then you should only join tournaments if either there are many days of thinking time or you are available to play more than half of the day every day in a 2-player tournament to have a guaranteed overlap in time. If you can't ensure that then you shouldn't sign up. There is no technical solution for availability of each user during the day and I can't think of anything that could solve that. Sleeping during tournament start is no excuse. The other player will also sleep at some point and lose time then.

Yes it's shitty behaviour to not make your last move when you are available and realizing it's your turn. But you don't know if that is the case or if they were just shown online because they forgot to switch off their computer when they went to bed. Or they had a lot of other games going on and didn't find their way back to yours yet. BGA can only solve this on a technical level and that is judging by the fact that you over-exhausted your thinking time - which would never happen if you'd only sign up to tournaments where you can guarantee enough availability.

As some who has worked as a computer programmer, I can think of lots of ways to solve it.
First of all, if a game score is calculated as you play rather than at the end, you award the player who is winning. This would be an easy fix as I have no doubt there is a field in the program that records when this is done and then you would just have to add an "if...then...else" statement into the subroutine that decides the winner. Easy.
Second, the program knows what time it is where you are so why not simply stop the playing clock counting down between the hours of say Midnight to 6am. This would make it a lot harder for people to cheat they way this person did.
Very simple solution but BGA programmers are either not smart enough to think to them or they don't care. I'm guessing the later.

In the case here, it was still afternoon where they were when I made my last mode they they definitely weren't in bed. When I messaged then they lied and said it was night. So it was definitely deliberate.

btw you made your point that you played with a shitty person .

your 1st solution doesnt work because you would just get the lead, and then let your time run out - or maybe I didnt got your idea
your 2nd solution is implemented - there are optional playing hours (in tournaments at least) and non optional ones in arena, I think (dont quote me on the second one)

You are right on the first one. Didn't consider that. So there needs to be someway of seeing if someone has deliberately not played such as seeing if they were online but didn't play.
The second one would work though and optional hours don't work because they don't take into account different timezones. They only work if you are in the same timezone as the creator of the tournament.

[davidr0607]

And how is cheating in any way ? Would a chess player say the other is cheating if he lose over time, even if he had a better position ?? That's just the rules of the game you accepted to play. Try other format if this one does not suit you.

How is it not cheating? If you go "I can't win this game properly so I will wait until times runs out and win by default" that is straight up cheating. You are taking advantage of a crazy system that doesn't award the player who is winning. In chess, you would get a draw, not a lose. And believe me I won't be entering anymore tournaments run by Sheffield_refugee as he seems to condone cheating.

It is sadly a part of the meta in competitive play, sorry man...

Only online. You can't get away with this in RL board gaming so the system (which is badly flawed) needs to be set up to represent the real world as closely as possible. This system fails to do that on many levels.

[frankenStain]

How is it not cheating? If you go "I can't win this game properly so I will wait until times runs out and win by default" that is straight up cheating. You are taking advantage of a crazy system that doesn't award the player who is winning. In chess, you would get a draw, not a lose. And believe me I won't be entering anymore tournaments run by Sheffield_refugee as he seems to condone cheating.

It is sadly a part of the meta in competitive play, sorry man...

Only online. You can't get away with this in RL board gaming so the system (which is badly flawed) needs to be set up to represent the real world as closely as possible. This system fails to do that on many levels.

i was actually talking about the meta in real, real life, competitions. i only played chess in that competitive manner, but that is freakin part of the meta - as is psycho play. i wouldnt change the system, except there is a better way - feel welcome to brain storm...

PS: didnt know they didnt take timezone into account when offering limits when to play turn-based ... feeling like that should be fixed, or dealt with differently maybe ( like some notfications, about the opponents being from other part of the world, which will slow down the game drasticly.. )

[SmilingDevil]

I made a suggestion to change the way exempt times are handled, care to upvote? Https://boardgamearena.com/bug?id=32133

[Ramona Rey]

People like davidr0607 should be punished, taking their moves longer and not logging into the game often enough. Only time is wasted because of such people, because it is often impossible to finish the game. If someone is notoriously exceeding the time limit, he should get a ban on BGA.

edit.
I checked this player and he is no longer on BGA. Apparently he got banned correctly for breaking fairplay rules and insulting other players. So the system works properly and effectively.

[SmilingDevil]

Maybe… maybe he quit for feeling he‘s been treated unfairly…

I did not quite understand his claim though, It might be that he did not understand the game at all.

He claims he had won by 26 points, but if he was the first player to start rolling and the other one still had a roll, then I would imagine that the other player actually exceeded his score while he was off-line. I think he totally got it backwards from the start.. ah, never mind…