Rule Change (variant) proposal

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andycupid
Posts: 48
Joined: 31 July 2015, 14:22

Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by andycupid »

As players have mentioned previously, this game is a nice, quick game with great art and light themes. However, luck factor can make this game really frustrating to play at times, and while some players think this isn't a design flaw, cards are scaled in such a way that it is more or less flawed. There are cards that are clearly too powerful for their time (stuff like 17, 18, 23, even 35), and cards that hardly see play unless being forced to. I hold a 66% winrate over 700 games (which is definitely top 10 btw, along with 77 avg score), and I can go on massive win/loss streaks fluctuating from high 200 to low 400 ELO due to these design flaws. (Yes, the annoying power-leveling ELO modifier doesn't help) It's simply so inconsistent that it loses it's enjoyment at times. Hence I'd like to proposal one single rule change, or just ask to adapt it as a variant, that doesn't require the game to be reworked in any way.

The rules are simple. Now at the start of the game we have the advanced starting hand setup available, which mitigates luck by a tiny bit, but oftentimes you see your opening hand and you still know it's going to take a miracle for the game to even be playable. I'd like to propose an open draft by dealing 10 cards at the beginning of the game, then players drafting in the order of ABBAAB (if 3 players or above, this is just a S drafting, where players draft in order then in reverse). This makes the game perfect information at the beginning, makes the players' starting hand a bit more equally balanced, and introduces the skill of drafting as well. I believe the premier skill this game tests is drafting, and sometimes drafting a suboptimal card just to be ahead on pick order in the next rounds can be important (a skill top players repeatedly abuse). Hence, with perfect information, we know what our opponent's hand is, and we can plan out future moves, as well as play around the opponent's strategy (i.e. hate drafting). I don't know if the game developer or designer sees this, but please take this into consideration. I can accept sometimes losing due to unlucky sanctuary draws and whatnot, but I get really tilted when I get insanely bad starting hands, rendering the game a loss at the very start. As another player pointed out, the max ELO anyone has achieved in this game is somewhere around 450~460, even lower than Lucky Numbers and other heavily luck based games. This game actually requires a lot of skill to properly play well, including drafting, resource management (you need to know what objectives are fulfillable), sanctuary drafting etc, but with already so many places where luck alters the course of games, I think we can use some tweaking to avoid this turning into a "who has the better starting hand" game.

Any other forms of suggestions are welcome, just to make this game better. We have a lot of enjoyers here, so hopefully the devs/designer may see this and consider :)
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Birre17
Posts: 1
Joined: 24 January 2023, 21:36

Re: Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by Birre17 »

I got very similar stats at this game as you and can agree with everything you said. Its indeed very frustrating when you get so bad starting cards that the game is lost right from the start. Thats why i really like your proposed drafting variant, especially for arena. It would reduce the luck component a bit more and make the game more enjoyable in my eyes.
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sylviel
Posts: 10
Joined: 27 November 2019, 08:53

Re: Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by sylviel »

That's a great idea, should be pretty straightforward to implement. Not sure if it would be enought though.
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andycupid
Posts: 48
Joined: 31 July 2015, 14:22

Re: Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by andycupid »

It's definitely not enough. Some cards are busted. Some cards are so bad that they hardly ever see play unless absolutely needed (e.g. to get a crucial first pick, to prevent breaking a sequence etc). The distribution of icons in sanctuaries are a bit off (there are way too many rocks when compared with other icons).

But in its core, the game is supposed to contain luck, and strategically mitigating it is part of skill that dictates long term win rate as well. We obviously can't propose to rework the cards to proper power scaling, but at least we can remove a factor which often makes games unplayable (i.e., oftentimes games being decided right at the opening hand). That should improve gameplay and enjoyment a lot, and I'm not even vouching for it to be the official format, I just like it to exist as a variant (just like the 3 vs 5 opening draft), so we at least get to choose it for Arena or for competitive community tournaments.

One other thing I'd like to talk about is the tiebreaker. I personally feel that "less total time spent" is better than "the player with the single card costing lowest time". Now obviously in super rare cases it might still be a tie, but at that point I'd say just call it a tie, or have a second tiebreaker as the current one. This is much less important than the opening draft, but every 1 in around 30~40 games when a tie does occur, I get a salty feeling that it's decided so randomly, and I can't even play around it because while playing the lowest card isn't technically bad, I'd hardly go out of my way just to ensure I win tiebreaker.
superorbe
Posts: 1
Joined: 07 January 2024, 05:32

Re: Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by superorbe »

100% agreed !!
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LightBlack
Posts: 2
Joined: 19 September 2022, 01:55

Re: Rule Change (variant) proposal

Post by LightBlack »

Wanted to throw in my 2 cents on this. I totally understand where you are coming from and some of the issues with luck in the game. However I don't think a draft is the best solution as it would lengthen the game and probably cause AP for some players trying to memorize and plan around everything that was taken by other players. Also the strong cards/ weak cards are still just strong and weak.

The best solution would be talking with the designer and implementing changes on a few cards that are known to be to strong/weak. I think realistically there are only 5-7 cards that need a change. It is good for a game to have some stronger and weaker cards in it, if everything was the same exact power level it would be quite boring.

That being said it is a much more difficult thing to implement but overall would help the health of the game for new and veteran players alike.
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