Overpowered beginner players

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Jellby
Posts: 3549
Joined: 31 December 2013, 12:22

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by Jellby »

JoysJoy wrote: 10 June 2024, 20:21 That word just means that account has not yet played on BGA
Just a note that "beginner" is game-specific. It means the account hasn't played that particular game, in ranked mode, on BGA before.

No matter how old your BGA account is, how many games/matches you have played before, you always start as "beginner" for every new game you try. Apart from what others have said about people having played the game in real life and therefore not being "true" beginners, there are other ways for someone to excel in their first match:

They may be an expert in some very similar game. For instance, Ticket to Ride and Ticket to Ride Europe are separate games here. Also Through the Ages and Through the Ages (II), or Russian Railroads and Ultimate Railroads, or Boomerang Australia, Boomerang USA and Boomerang Europe.

They may have played many similar (but not as much) games. I'd say mastering many worker-placement games, or many trick-taking games will give you an edge in the next worker-placement or trick-taking game you try.

They may have read some resources about the best strategies in that particular game.

They may have played many matches in friendly mode, solo or with friends.
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nik592
Posts: 1390
Joined: 16 October 2022, 13:54

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by nik592 »

Cile wrote: 11 June 2024, 01:48 I didn't name a website, and it's not a board game service. Everyone on PC already knows [boiled water] exists, and I wouldn't exactly call it a competitor with BGA.
Huh, that's interesting that they moderated that service. I agree with you on all points, they're not a board game service and I don't feel like they compete with BGA, although I guess there is an platform/app on there that kind of does? But yes, BGA mods seem a little over-zealous about other platforms. Advertising, sure. But most of us know who else is out there.
RobertBr
Posts: 667
Joined: 08 July 2016, 15:57

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by RobertBr »

nik592 wrote: 11 June 2024, 09:16
Cile wrote: 11 June 2024, 01:48 I didn't name a website, and it's not a board game service. Everyone on PC already knows [boiled water] exists, and I wouldn't exactly call it a competitor with BGA.
Huh, that's interesting that they moderated that service. I agree with you on all points, they're not a board game service and I don't feel like they compete with BGA, although I guess there is an platform/app on there that kind of does? But yes, BGA mods seem a little over-zealous about other platforms. Advertising, sure. But most of us know who else is out there.
The moderation has always been very consistent, they remove any reference to any site that overlaps with BGA, so its not an enormous surprise. It might not be a good policy but its not an inconsistent one.
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Cile
Posts: 301
Joined: 13 March 2012, 06:01

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by Cile »

RobertBr wrote: 11 June 2024, 11:53
nik592 wrote: 11 June 2024, 09:16
Cile wrote: 11 June 2024, 01:48 I didn't name a website, and it's not a board game service. Everyone on PC already knows [boiled water] exists, and I wouldn't exactly call it a competitor with BGA.
Huh, that's interesting that they moderated that service. I agree with you on all points, they're not a board game service and I don't feel like they compete with BGA, although I guess there is an platform/app on there that kind of does? But yes, BGA mods seem a little over-zealous about other platforms. Advertising, sure. But most of us know who else is out there.
The moderation has always been very consistent, they remove any reference to any site that overlaps with BGA, so its not an enormous surprise. It might not be a good policy but its not an inconsistent one.
Nobody said it was inconsistent, just that it was absurd and over zealous. It would be like Twitter banning the words "Facebook" and "Reddit" because they are competitors. (And now I wonder if this post is going to be moderated as well because it turns out you can play connect 4 on [book in your face] or something.)

I created a feedback suggestion. I don't expect it to go anywhere: https://boardgamearena.com/bug?id=127027
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ErikLevin
Posts: 218
Joined: 06 January 2024, 14:13

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by ErikLevin »

Cile wrote: 11 June 2024, 16:37 It would be like Twitter banning the words "Facebook" and "Reddit" because they are competitors.
... Musk tried to do exactly that. :D https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-med ... -rcna62305

The policy was quickly rescinded for being, well, absurd and overzealous...
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Grimwold
Posts: 120
Joined: 16 April 2020, 01:57

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by Grimwold »

Cile wrote: 11 June 2024, 16:37 It would be like Twitter banning the words "Facebook" and "Reddit" because they are competitors.
Not quite, BGA and *, * or * are way less notorious than Facebook and reddit. So a lot of people may never have heard of them.

I know * because I played on it before coming to BGA, I frankly don't remember a policy like that but that 5-ish years ago so my memories are blurry.


But yeah, citing other name can make people curious and check them. And when they are on *, * or * (among others) they are not on BGA watching ads.



*User edit: please notice I did not specifically name other gaming platforms
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Jaxxten
Posts: 2
Joined: 13 May 2024, 18:01

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by Jaxxten »

JoysJoy wrote: 10 June 2024, 20:21
People take these numbers too seriously! A higher number does not make you a better player. And there is no litmus test for 'beginner'. That word just means that account has not yet played on BGA, not that you inherintly know more/ are better than another player.

It would not due anyone any good to try to take down others by playing as a beginner. The ELO is 'weighted'' so when each beginner plays more games, their wins are worth less. The point of getting more ELO at first is so those are not 'beginners' to the game itself can quickly join the ranks of those with equal skills.

All you have to do is not play beginners to stop needing to complain.

Considering that you, yourself, have only been on BGA less than a month, you yourself have taken huge advantage of the 'beginner' title to get the ELO you are trying to protect. You will soon notice a huge lowering of you ELO power. Actually, maybe that is the real trouble here. Now you have played a few weeks, your own wins are worth less than other people's wins, to get you into the real category of your skill set.
It's not 'just' numbers. The numbers need to be taken seriously because, presumeably, they are used to match you against other players. But seeing as my ELO can't drop below 100, i'm stuck in the 2nd catergory where i guess i don't belong, considering as i'm at a 90% loss rate.
it's very disheartening to be losing constantly at almost every game. I think you should be able to drop back down if it means matching you with appropriate players. I wouldn't care about the number if the system actually worked.
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Meeplelowda
Posts: 3836
Joined: 14 March 2020, 10:31

Re: Overpowered beginner players

Post by Meeplelowda »

Jaxxten wrote: 06 August 2024, 23:08I think you should be able to drop back down if it means matching you with appropriate players.
Funny thing is that the 100 Elo floor was put in place because fragile egos couldn't handle being shown that they weren't as good as they thought they were based on being a big fish in a small pond.
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