Leaving Hanabi when things are not perfect

[hezekiah]

This needs to be addressed.

[Lara8818]

My preference is to avoid both quitting and table-talk, and I've come across a lot of bullying and outright anger because of that, including deliberate bombing. Currently I'm actually stuck at a table because of this (didn't look closely enough to realize it was untimed when I sat down, and when I didn't agree to quit the other player simply logged off). So no games for me for a while, I guess.

At least it gives me even more reason to look forward to playing IRL again someday. (When I think of how much effort the people I've played with put into keeping a straight face so as not to give away information unfairly, the chat here is beyond belief sometimes. I'm not talking about explaining things like finesse to players who don't know - technically cheating but helping someone learn. But straight-up demands to play X card, then getting mad when you don't act on what they say because you didn't come by the info honestly...)

[Recyclops]

This needs to be addressed.

This really does need to be addressed. I shouldn't have to write "please don't join if you plan to quit if we can't get perfect." Why do people bother playing a GAME if they're just going to abandon because they lose one 5?

I am fine if you have to abandon because you need to leave, or a similar reason. But seriously, after losing one 5? Admins, please look into addressing this somehow

[ozymandias_]

I think the idea in this post (boardgamearena.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=102&t=17957) is a simple solution to this problem. If you can easily see who abandons a lot, you can avoid starting games with abandoners.

I know there are many suggested fixes in this thread, but the key advantage of my suggestion is simplicity. The only change is to provide more information to us players, and then we as players can decide how to take it into account. Who can disagree that abandon rates are important signals of player quality? And that the objective of Elo and the expert/master distinction is to signal player quality?

If people want to keep abandoning, they can without losing their Elo.

If people want to avoid playing with people who abandon, they can more easily.

Its even possible this could shift the culture on BGA --- if people don't want to have a "bad" abandon rate visible to everyone, then they reconsider abandoning. But if not, at least for now we can put aside philosophical arguments about whether abandoning is okay or not, and just make it easier for different people to choose differently.

[zeinab001]

not a bad suggestion. i see really two way of thinking here some are against who dont abondon telling they arent hostages. on the other hand they are players who says abondoning without getting elo reduce is the cauce of problem that we cant trust elos any more to find good players so showing abondoning rate is a good suggestion for now

[ViolentSilence]

Reading this thread (and the linked one) is a major reminder why I only play Hanabi with people I know in real life! It's absurd of people to expect all other players to adopt a series of conventions that are not in the rules so they can get a maximum score, which completely sucks out the joy of people working with each other to find these tricks for themselves. It changes the game from one based on learning about how your friends play to something soulless and algorithmic.

Honestly, there should not be an ELO ranking on Hanabi - that's a system that is meant to help establish equally skilled opponents, which makes it meaningless for a cooperative game. A lot of this bad behaviour seems to come from people seeking validation rather than enjoying playing, and 'fixing' the implementation on the site isn't going to change the personality flaws. The magic circle is meant to be that players work together for the highest score they can get, and it's worrying the that you get people so obsessed with perfect scores that they make the game a lot less fun for other people.

It's a lovely filler game for people who like puzzles, but once it is solved (and the conventions largely do that), it's time to move on and find a new challenge, not chase a meaningless ELO number that no-one in the real world is going to care about...

[Ju2citron]

Hello,
I'm new to this site, and I'm glad to found this forum.

Because I love hannabi (but not my family) so I was happy to be able to play online, but in the end I never managed to finish a round because everyone wants to give up after few minutes !!! and I didn't understand why...
Apparently some gamers even refuse to play with me because I don't have a good ELO and/or a good Karma ?

It gave me a bad image of this website ! until I come across your posts. I understand better why but it still saddens me a lot...
In the end it will be very hard for me to find a "good place" because my score will not increase even though I know this game well.

[N_Faker]

Apparently some gamers even refuse to play with me because I don't have a good ELO and/or a good Karma ?

Your low ELO is actually desirable for higher ELO players, as that lowers the average ELO of the players, and therefore increases the ELO gain after a perfect game.

The players were probably dismissive of you because you didn't follow their conventions, didn't abandon when they wanted to, talked back or played too slowly.

The Hanabi community on BGA is probably the most toxic of all the games on here, you may enjoy other games more.

[ViolentSilence]

The Hanabi community on BGA is probably the most toxic of all the games on here, you may enjoy other games more.

It'll be interesting to see if other co-op games end up adopting a similarly toxic ELO chase. In the real world, Hanabi tends to be a game that gets played out by groups so it's curious as to why it has such a different feel on here. Is it because it can be meta-gamed to death?

[N_Faker]

The Hanabi community on BGA is probably the most toxic of all the games on here, you may enjoy other games more.

It'll be interesting to see if other co-op games end up adopting a similarly toxic ELO chase. In the real world, Hanabi tends to be a game that gets played out by groups so it's curious as to why it has such a different feel on here. Is it because it can be meta-gamed to death?

I would expect it to be less severe than Hanabi, at the least. As the incentive for forcing abandons is far reduced.
But depending on if the new co-op games award ranking trophies. They may become just as toxic for other rank chasing reasons.