Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

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Pinta
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Pinta » 14 January 2020, 19:06

Well yeah, it's easy when you don't take into account things that don't go your way. Please don't pretend that the hand distribution is not preponderant in 3 players as well, you're only talking about the manufactured goods but let's talk about the materials. Only one of each in Age 2, if you have Gizah and you're not the first one to have the Stone ? Well, nothing you can do either. The caravansery is an incredible boost as it allows you to basically dictate what your two opponents are gonna have, even more if one brown card has been mucked for one reason or another Age 1.

Same principles, just different cards. Yes the dynamic is a lot different (race for the gray cards, more war), but you just have to adapt. That doesn't make the game THAT more random.

Not trying to argue about this stuff honestly, I just don't want the developers thinking that the very vocal minority who only plays 3p is anything but this : a vocal minority.

Gunslinger99
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Joined: 15 December 2019, 17:32

Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Gunslinger99 » 14 January 2020, 19:14

At 3P, if someone denies with the 2 Clay card, it means I can punish them by taking military.
If someone takes the Caravansery, it means they didn't take a red and can be punished too.

Gunslinger99
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Gunslinger99 » 14 January 2020, 19:16

Majority never means anything ;)

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Waterd103
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Waterd103 » 14 January 2020, 23:40

I've been in the elo top 10 for a while in 7 wonders. I agree 4p is higher variance than 3p. But more important, i think at 4p the game is worse, for the following reasons
1. Part of the skill in 7 wonders is understanding wheeling and play around it, in 4p wheeling is less of a thing.
2. i think the card distribution is just "bad" for 4p. There are too many resources in 4p in age 2. Whichi leads to two problems a). Much of the counterresource tactics of age 1 that are very interesting is removed, you cna't really block people*control resources like you can in 3p. b) you need to shift much of the variance of the game to age 2, you can't really setup your resource base in age 1 becuase you need to spend some actions in resources in age 2 or you are gonna be flooded.
3. The opponent you don't interact with in 7 wonders become more of a wild card, if he is bad, the neighboords benefit but in you front don't. That's very annoying and oftne game deciding.

With that said, im enjoying having to learn 4p, since its such different beast to 3p. But i have no doubt that is a less interesting game competitively.

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N_Faker
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by N_Faker » 15 January 2020, 00:28

Waterd103 wrote:
14 January 2020, 23:40
1. Part of the skill in 7 wonders is understanding wheeling and play around it, in 4p wheeling is less of a thing.
What is "wheeling"?

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Waterd103
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Waterd103 » 15 January 2020, 01:10

Wheeling is draft games, coined at competitive MTG draft, is the concept that hands will wheel, that is make a whole round around the table.

So understanding which card is going to comeback based on what each other player will pick, it's a very important and interesting part of 7 wonders 3 player.

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CB Droege
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by CB Droege » 15 January 2020, 19:19

Alternate view-point. 7 Wonders is designed with 7 players (and no wheeling) in mind, wheeling is an unfortunate side effect of low player count games. Something you have to deal with, even though it's not part of the game as intended.

We can argue all day about what is and is not "an important part of the game" as we each see it.

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Waterd103
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by Waterd103 » 15 January 2020, 19:50

Sure, but f I Have to play 7 wonders 7 players I would not play the game. I find a 7 player experience awful.

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CB Droege
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by CB Droege » 16 January 2020, 11:45

I find the 3-player experience awful. It's all just opinions and what you enjoy. I hope that the constantly changing rules from season to season means that we both get to play games that we enjoy in Arena some of the time. And when our favorite rules are not being played, we can try something different, or we can go play simple mode for a while, NBD. ;D

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DelegateX
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Re: Feedback for Arena mode for 7 Wonders

Post by DelegateX » 16 January 2020, 15:36

CB Droege wrote:
15 January 2020, 19:19
Alternate view-point. 7 Wonders is designed with 7 players (and no wheeling) in mind, wheeling is an unfortunate side effect of low player count games. Something you have to deal with, even though it's not part of the game as intended.

We can argue all day about what is and is not "an important part of the game" as we each see it.
Here you are making a valid point about the nature of the game, but forgetting the setting of the argument/topic, namely, the Arena and trying to determine the most skilled player. As the aim of the Arena is to determine the most skilled player, I'd stick to the idea of finding the best suited setting for that. And just to be exact, 7 Wonders is designed for up to 7 players in mind ;).

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