Board Game Arena

So I've been reported and moderated several times for ruining games or playing poorly, and asking if it's okay to abandon or concede the game when my play is poor. Except that's not against the rules? And it's expressly not against the rules - the reporting rules expressly say that you can't report someone for poor play as long as they abide by the terms of service. And you can't report someone for quitting a game in progress. The rules expressly state that in both instances you should red thumb the player instead. I'd gladly accept being red thumbed in both situations. In two player games you can concede when you are losing. That should be the case in any game. No one should be forced to finish a game for fear that not finishing would result in their ability to play other games would be restricted.

And to add on top of that, apparently asking to concede a game is insulting somehow? Because every moderation has been for "insults" or "aggression".

newuserhandle wrote: ↑12 March 2022, 07:52 And to add on top of that, apparently asking to concede a game is insulting somehow?

There is a reason that you cannot concede in games with more than 2 players. Because usually the other players want to play the game to the end and have a rated result, even if YOU have a bad day. By asking to stop the game before the end, you essentially devalue the time and emotions of your opponents, and in this way it is offending.

Imagine you are winning in a 4p game and then one player concedes, you are not the winner anymore, you are one of 3 winners and it's also super annoying to not properly finish a game you win.

All 4 player games have 3 losers.
In most games, there is at least 1 player that knows they are not going to win a long time before the end. So if it's a natural for the losing player to quit the game at this point, then all these games would never finish. I think everyone would like the opposite of this.

Just take your time to reflect on the game and the mistakes you made. This is the best way to become better. You have more to gain and more lessons to learn, and ultimately you'll less likely be in the position again in the future.

In 2 players it might be OK to concede, but even then often it can be frustrating to not complete the game. You want to see your best score, ect. You put the time in to play the game in the first place, why not complete it?

Could it be that you skipped the part that your behaviour is critizised and sanctioned is in the cooperative game Pandemic, where this also could be seen as cheating ELO, because a loss would reduce your ELO lots, so you instead push for abandons?

I know this very well from the cooperative game Hanabi, and there the rules and sanctions against ppl pushing for abandons and ELO cheating should be much more serious.

I mean, I understand it's in bad sportsmanship. But it's not actually against the terms of service, which is my point. If people don't want to play with me because I recognize a losing situation, and then those same people would rather play for another 30 minutes in a game that can't be won, I'm probably happier never to have to play with them again than they not play again with me. Go ahead and red thumb me.

As far as the insulting or aggressive language, the moderation expressly states that the moderation is for quitting games, which, again, isn't actually against the terms of service or the moderation policy.

And I understand it's frustrating to players winning a game to have a losing player quit, but they still receive points when a player quits. But for the losing player, they are actually being held hostage by this site's clumsy policies, because quitting a game can cause them to be unable to play any games at all, forcing them to waste time on a game they can't win. That's just silly.

newuserhandle wrote: ↑12 March 2022, 11:17 I mean, I understand it's in bad sportsmanship. But it's not actually against the terms of service, which is my point.

It's (arguably) against' the terms of use (emphasis mine):

BGA will not tolerate any cheating and/or lack of fair play, whether through the use of cheating software, analysis of communication protocols or code, use of multiple Accounts, collusion with other Users, leaving the game before its normal end, use of game blocking tactics in order to force other Users to quit, or the use of obscene or foul language, etc.

newuserhandle wrote: ↑12 March 2022, 11:17

Can't you tell us in plain English that you are talking about a cooperative game? Why you even start a forum discussion about this without giving us the full picture of what you are talking about.

Quitting games already has preset penalties.

As Jellby writes, this actually is in the terms indeed. Also the moderation msg, assuming it is the same as for Hanabi, is 100% clear:

If you join a game you are expected to play the game to the end. Using the 'abandon this game collectively' feature is supposed to be for emergencies only, not to simply stop playing a game because you are not doing as well as you hoped or would rather do something else. If you commit to a game, please play the game fully. You are not the only one at the table; other players have a right to the game being played out fully and fairly as well.

The only thing to discuss here is why this still is not acted on consistently, e.g. with automatic ELO loss for abandon abusers.