What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

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iBlameLuck
Posts: 4
Joined: 30 December 2023, 08:07

What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by iBlameLuck »

I've been hovering between 400-500 ELO after literally thousands of games spanning multiple accounts over 3 years and I can't ever seem to cross this barrier. It's extremely demoralizing and has conditioned me to be overly cynical. For anyone reading this at or over 600, what "clicked" for you that finally got you over this plateau? I've always wanted to be better at this game.
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Pistol Star
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Joined: 11 October 2016, 02:41

Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by Pistol Star »

For me, it was to analyze the games I've lost as hard as I could. I've tried to really dig deep to understand in great detail all the reasons why I've lost.
I've also searched for reoccuring patterns in losing games. E.g. on which boards do I tend to lose more often?
Which stronger opposition approaches usually beat me often?

Asking the right questions is key.
I'll give you a couple examples.

1. Was my approach on this board wrong?
2. What approach did the higher ranked winning player take and did I lose often versus this kind of approach in the past?
3. What were the moments in this game, in which I was unsure what to do? => These decisions are usually the ones in which we make the biggest mistakes. Analyze these moments first by looking at what consequences our decisions had and if they were positive or negative.
4. Maybe there are often moments in many games where we feel, that we suddenly fall behind. => Solution: Analyze these moments/the moves that ultimately built up to these moments to better understand them and then find better moves/solutions.
5. Maybe you feel good and confident in-game in the majority of your games, but then surprisingly end up losing games and don't understand why. => Probable solution: Work on understanding the math of the game better. Really work your self through, what actions score you how many points + giving you maybe other benefits. These other benefits should also be translated into points. Really look for non obvious points a certain action nets you. I am confident that over 99% of players don't thoroughly understand the math behind their moves. If you can master this skill you will have a huge edge over pretty much any opponent in this regard.
6. Replay your losses and also focus on your opponent's decision points, especially if they are ranked higher than you.
Then think for your self what their best move is at any given point and compare your solution to theirs in advance.
If their solution does differentiate from your solution, analyze it in-depth and try to understand their thought process and why their move might (that's likely) or might not be (that's unlikely) more precise than your solution.

Overall, the higher ELO a player has, the better they understand the game and therefore the more precise their moves are on average.
Always find your biggest current weakness and do everything you can to get rid of this weakness. When you successfully eliminated your biggest weakness, you will automatically have a new biggest weakness. Now focus on that weakness, and so on and so forth.

The by far best tool you have to improve your game is replaying all your losses and really take the time to think through every decision in detail.
That helps so much, because you already know the exact outcome of the game and you have zero time pressure.
It's tremendously better to analyze one game very thoroughly in x time than analyzing three games half hearted in the same amount of time.
Do not play a new game after a loss, if you haven't yet analyzed your previous loss! This is the most important advise I can give to you.

If you do all of that, it is inevitable that you will become a 600+ player at some point.
The exact same procedure is the way to get you to potentially 800+ as well.

Every player has probably over 60 decisions per game. If you are on average just finding slightly better decisions per move, your ELO will already skyrocket.
Last edited by Pistol Star on 24 February 2024, 11:25, edited 4 times in total.
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oranjon
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Joined: 26 July 2021, 11:48

Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by oranjon »

Pistol Star wrote: 24 February 2024, 03:26 The by far best tool you have to improve your game is replaying all your losses and really take the time to think through every decision in detail.
Thank you Pistol Star for an excellent and helpful post. Much more useful than what I expected which was a list of pros and cons of each type of tile etc. In fact, it’s good advice for life in general I feel :-)
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Pistol Star
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Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by Pistol Star »

Thank you for your warm words. I'm glad you found this post that helpful.
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liumeimei
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Joined: 14 December 2023, 06:07

Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by liumeimei »

I reviewed your one losing game. I don't think you have a good understanding of some basic principles, which are not very complex. A high elo player tutor will help. Or just simply review games between high elo players and think why they are doing this.
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DoctorFianchetto
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Joined: 09 June 2023, 13:26

Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by DoctorFianchetto »

All of Pistolstar's great advice is also the best way to improve at chess.

However in chess there is a huge amount of literature on the principles, strategies from beginner to master level, and a wealth of coaches for personalised training.

This does not exist for Castles of Burgundy, which presents an obstacle to newer players who may not be able to figure out these basic principles on their own, and so analysing their own games or strong player games is like walking through a dark forest with no map.
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Pistol Star
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Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by Pistol Star »

DoctorFianchetto wrote: 24 February 2024, 19:36 All of Pistolstar's great advice is also the best way to improve at chess.

However in chess there is a huge amount of literature on the principles, strategies from beginner to master level, and a wealth of coaches for personalised training.

This does not exist for Castles of Burgundy, which presents an obstacle to newer players who may not be able to figure out these basic principles on their own, and so analysing their own games or strong player games is like walking through a dark forest with no map.
This procedure is also the best way to improve at Poker. A game that I like to compare a bit to The Castles of Burgundy, as both games need a strong understanding of how the math of the game works, how the different types of probabilities of the games work and how to think non-results-oriented, but also how to stay disciplined and not tilt your money/elo off, when things inevitably go heavily against you from time to time.

But both Chess and Poker are incredibly more complex games with a nearly endless amount of possible improvement.
It's nowadays impossible to become a world class player in both Chess or Poker on your own without the right access to top level theoretical information about the game and endless hours of studying.
In terms of poker there is also mass data analysis, which can be extremely powerful to see where the player pool, in which you play in, deviates the most from optimal play and with which kind of exploiting moves you can take the maximum advantage of these massive deviations.

Here we have a player who already has a specific amount of understanding of The Castles of Burgundy game.
A player with experience of thousands of games with a already quite decent average ELO.
So I believe, this type of player can take the next step in their game, but only if they work smart enough, but also hard enough for it.
At some point you can't reach a higher level of play without putting at least some amount of smart work in.
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Pistol Star
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Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by Pistol Star »

liumeimei wrote: 24 February 2024, 16:16 I reviewed your one losing game. I don't think you have a good understanding of some basic principles, which are not very complex. A high elo player tutor will help. Or just simply review games between high elo players and think why they are doing this.
Reviewing in great detail games between high elo players is definitely one of the very best, if not the best way, of improving in most games on BGA.
All the information is publicly available. Just think through both players moves one by one in advance and then compare your solution with their solutions.
If you and them ended up with the same solution... perfect!
This way you can quickly see, which principles you have already mastered.
Then you can be very confident in-game about certain spots, because you know you can play these as well as 600+ players.
When you spot any differences in your solutions to their solutions, really dig deep to try to understand why they choose another solution.
You are probably a good enough player to understand most, if not all of their thought processes, if you really try hard.

Then when your next game begins, you are already a better player and way more confident playing. Rinse and repeat.
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liumeimei
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Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by liumeimei »

Pistol Star wrote: 24 February 2024, 21:09
liumeimei wrote: 24 February 2024, 16:16 I reviewed your one losing game. I don't think you have a good understanding of some basic principles, which are not very complex. A high elo player tutor will help. Or just simply review games between high elo players and think why they are doing this.
Reviewing in great detail games between high elo players is definitely one of the very best, if not the best way, of improving in most games on BGA.
All the information is publicly available. Just think through both players moves one by one in advance and then compare your solution with their solutions.
If you and them ended up with the same solution... perfect!
This way you can quickly see, which principles you have already mastered.
Then you can be very confident in-game about certain spots, because you know you can play these as well as 600+ players.
When you spot any differences in your solutions to their solutions, really dig deep to try to understand why they choose another solution.
You are probably a good enough player to understand most, if not all of their thought processes, if you really try hard.

Then when your next game begins, you are already a better player and way more confident playing. Rinse and repeat.
Exactly. That's what I wanna say in detail.
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Ra1ro
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Joined: 26 September 2021, 19:12

Re: What separates a 6XX+ ELO player from a 4XX ELO player?

Post by Ra1ro »

For me thing that the most improved my game is playing strong opponents. Having many games with opponents way below your level is very boring and I think develops many bad habits. When you wait for an opponent I highly advise to filter in an options to only be matched to ones on your level. Even better if you can make friends with top players and discuss mistakes with them.
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