why on line gamers are so impatient?

[Baddy1970]

Hello, I'm a regular tabletop gamer, but I recently started playing on bga especially Ark nova. I can't conceive of being expelled from a game because I exceed the time limit by a few moments (often because you are performing multiple actions in combos). Let me explain better if an action makes me perform a second one, time should be added. it's really boring to lose your game and your reputation (obviously the frustrated opponent kicks you out because he's losing). What do you think, is it a problem of online players? in real life no one would kick me out

[Remkar]

Hello, I'm a regular tabletop gamer, but I recently started playing on bga especially Ark nova. I can't conceive of being expelled from a game because I exceed the time limit by a few moments (often because you are performing multiple actions in combos). Let me explain better if an action makes me perform a second one, time should be added. it's really boring to lose your game and your reputation (obviously the frustrated opponent kicks you out because he's losing). What do you think, is it a problem of online players? in real life no one would kick me out

There are probably dozens of reasons for different players at different times.

The point is, though, you seem to be going over your time limit on real-time, fast speed games.

Just stop playing those. People who play those are identifying themselves as wanting to play VERY fast. Maybe they have someplace to be, maybe they get bored easily, maybe they want to get more games in each day, maybe they're hoping for slow people to boot for easy wins, who knows... but they've identified themselves as wanting to play VERY FAST.

You appear to be a person that doesn't want to play that fast, so just just choose normal (or slow) games, and you shouldn't have an issue.

You also mention this wouldn't happen in real life. In real life, though, you're usually playing with friends, and are in a situation where you can't just easily jump to another table with faster players if you're frustrated with a slow player (or you know them and are more forgiving).

And, there definitely are situations like this in real life (think chess matches with timers).

[Baddy1970]

thanks for your point of view. the point that I do not agree with is that you are penalized. I agree that one is kicked out of the match, but the double penalty for a decision made by another seems to me an exaggerated punishment.
keep in mind that some turns are almost instantaneous (pass and take a plus), it should be like in chess one time limit per game not per turn.
finally, unlike chess tournaments, here we are playing for nothing, I believe that non-competitive play should be for fun and a little tolerance and farplay wouldn't hurt

[nik592]

Part of playing a time-limited game on BGA is that you're signing up to abide by the time limit. If you don't, there's no way to tell the difference between someone who was booted after going over by 3 seconds or 5 minutes (or days in a turn-based game), or to tell the difference between someone who was taking their turns, just slowly, vs someone who just vanished, short of reviewing each game where that happens which is obviously a lot of probably needless work for admins. So it's at the discretion of the other player to decide if they're willing to forgive the transgression against the agreed upon time limit, and some won't boot you for going slightly over, or if you're playing regularly (I don't tend to myself). But it does mean that all bootings take a reputation hit to dissuade people from going over time, or choosing games where they can't stick to the time limit. The reputation hit you take is pretty small, even though it feels not great, unless you happen to keep doing it. If you're playing regular games, you'll probably have your reputation back to full within a week or less.

If you don't want to play with time limits (or penalties) at all, choose Friendly mode. That said, that mode doesn't come with ELO, so if you want that, then time limits are a part of it. But exceeding time limits comes with the threat of penalty. That's just how BGA works.

[Kayvon]

Come join us at slower and turn-based games! Lots of patient gamers on this site, for sure.

It's like changing into the fast line and complaining when people line up behind you. If you want to go slower, choose the slow lane. No judgement -- that's why there are different lanes here.

[mturton]

Part of playing a time-limited game on BGA is that you're signing up to abide by the time limit. If you don't, there's no way to tell the difference between someone who was booted after going over by 3 seconds or 5 minutes (or days in a turn-based game), or to tell the difference between someone who was taking their turns, just slowly, vs someone who just vanished, short of reviewing each game where that happens which is obviously a lot of probably needless work for admins. So it's at the discretion of the other player to decide if they're willing to forgive the transgression against the agreed upon time limit, and some won't boot you for going slightly over, or if you're playing regularly (I don't tend to myself). But it does mean that all bootings take a reputation hit to dissuade people from going over time, or choosing games where they can't stick to the time limit. The reputation hit you take is pretty small, even though it feels not great, unless you happen to keep doing it. If you're playing regular games, you'll probably have your reputation back to full within a week or less.

If you don't want to play with time limits (or penalties) at all, choose Friendly mode. That said, that mode doesn't come with ELO, so if you want that, then time limits are a part of it. But exceeding time limits comes with the threat of penalty. That's just how BGA works.

how does one choose friendly mode? that choice never seems to be available

[nccc]

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[Blacktango]

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[Trouncing]

I agree that players are basically agreeing to be bound by a certain amount of time. These players are also agreeing to play with the other players. There are definitely reasons to be frustrated with a player who, for example, takes every second of time on every turn for an entire game. There are also situations, for example, where a player has a single power outage and returns in time to play and is skip spammed immediately upon -0:01 to avoid an ELO drop.

The player could even be actively attempting to put in their moves and fully capable of staying out of negative for the rest of game but sufficiently hindered from finishing the violating turn by the spammy nature of the button. This is further complicated by certain games in which using the chat is not normal.

I originally brought this up in this https://boardgamearena.com/forum/viewto ... 08#p152008 discussion.


In this situation, I believe the following solutions are suitable to having one frustrated player flipping a table with two others over the fourth offending player.

1.) The red "Skip players out of time" button can be accompanied by a green "Donate to players out of time" button. This would allow the remaining players who see a frustrated player attempting to skip a game they want to finish to donate remaining time of their own, raising game satisfaction. https://boardgamearena.com/bug?id=96914

2.) Break up the turn time into phases where applicable. Many games have longer complex moves within turns, evidenced by the "I would like some time to think" prompt. This would allow the games to possibly move even faster by taking 10-30 seconds of a 1:30 turn and putting them in useful phases, while eliminating the ELO skip loophole.

3.) Make "Skip players out of time" a vote requiring all positive timer players, like the "abandon game" feature. This is the most direct option but might be more difficult to implement. The fact that this is not the case already makes me think the majority of players are indeed impatient and unconcerned with the quality of play for even non-offending players.

4.) Add a category to red thumb called "out of time abuse". This would allow some algorithm action with players that anger the entire table by skipping an active players. This would give devs some insight into what percentage of players think it ruins the experience or even at how far into a game it is more of an annoyance to skip than it is to finish.

[Cile]

I believe the current solution is a "Time bank" that holds up to 3x the turn time. If you use less then the time limit per turn you bank the extra, if you use more you use up part of your bank.

So if there's an issue and you get booted from the game at -0:01 you didn't get booted for going a second over the turn limit, you went three times over the turn limit. If someone has gone three times longer than the turn time without an action it's fair to boot them. You don't know if they're coming back in 5 seconds or not at all.

I could see an argument for not allowing players to be booted if they are actively playing (board has updated with new information in the last 10s or so) but as someone who plays tables at 2 moves / day and ends up with players who routinely take longer than 24hours to make their move I have no patience for people who exceeded their time bank. Play at a slower table you can keep up with.