option to turn off Confirm removed

[franck67000]

Thanks Cile, exactly.

And not to forget that ppl also could have several accounts and play azul with another one than they are active in the forum with, or speak up for another active player that isnt active here, …

But it‘s easier ofc to attack personally and give out funny names, than to consider other opinions.

Sorry for the "funny" name, my phone auto-corrected, and i didnt notice.... If only i had an undo option

Anyway, you all think that people use the undo button cause of missclicks, but the only times i saw someone using it, it's because i had a good move available to me from the moved tiles.

If the undo was about "you picked 3 yellow tiles, are you sure ?" and not moving the board, i wouldn't mind the change. If it's helping to do the job you should do in your mind, then it's a "help" for beginners, and i dont want to play with or against such helps.

If you compare to an IRL case, younger football players, plays on shorter fields, smaller goals, ...
Would you play against an opponent of your age, but who will defend a smaller goal ?

People who can't picture the Azul's board in their mind, should play on tables with confirmation on, and those who can should be able to play against opponents that agree on that, espacially when they pay to play...

[X_MIKE_X]

Mike, Mike, Mike. You're throwing a temper tantrum over something that does not change how YOU play the game.

You personally want to skip Confirm, you can do that. But what you're asking for is something that would strip everyone - all of your opponents - of their ability to choose whether to skip or not.

This isn't something that changes the rules of Azul. It only changes the interface, allowing it to be more granular, so that each player can decide for themselves whether they see and use the Confirm function. User interface changes should not be under a single player's control - each person should have their own control on that, to the extent that the platform allows. In this case, separating the Confirm out to a personal choice instead of a per-game choice is superior. The fact that you don't like how it works is irrelevant, because for the VAST range of players, this is either no change at all, or an improvement.

And you're claiming that WE'RE the ones taking choice away from YOU? Hilarious. Your game hasn't changed. No rules to the game have changed. The way you interact with the game hasn't changed. Only the way that other people do. So... if you're so strong on personal choice, why are you against this?

We know why. Cile nailed it on the head, in the other thread about this.

Don't forget that Simple Game (default mode) is for casual play. If the game goes too slow for you because of people Undoing their actions, try a different mode. Play on Fast. Go play Arena. I assure you your opponents will be faster there. But speed isn't really your problem, is it?

Your flexing about the number of games you've played, and your "boycott," aren't going to change things. Sites never benefit from kowtowing to the loudest forum fighters, or the biggest complainers. Because no matter what they do, SOMEONE is going to complain about it. It's impossible to please everyone... but you can do things that benefit the greatest number.

And no, there's no "compromise" possible, because the actual compromise has already been made - that is, something that allows each and every player to have it how they want it. But you don't want a compromise, you want to try to force things back to how you want it... for everyone. Or at least, everyone you play against.

This was a change made to benefit everyone, from the newest of new players, up to the peak pros. And each person now has their choice on how to play. If you want to keep holding your breath, well, have fun with that. You're the only one suffering from your loss. You're not winning this fight.

Oh well. Now, it's a personal attack. We can't voice an opinion without being ridiculed.

"temper tantrum"? seriously? Being vocal about something you care about is that for you? Nice. A win for free speech!
"hilarious"? Oh. My point of view is hilarious now... Okay.
"boycott"? I don't think you know what that word mean. I am not inciting anyone to stop playing the game. There is no concerned effort here. I stopped playing because the game is frustratingly slow (to me) since the change. It's a very personal choice.
"biggest complainers"? I thought we could voice here how we felt about the change. Apparently not. I'm so sorry. My bad!
"You're the only one"? really? I thought I saw others saying the same. Their opinion probably doesn't count for you either.

You are putting it as I am seeking an unfair advantage over the other players. Absolutely NOT. I wanted to play with the people that have same preference. The Confirm timeout is just too long. I could have played my turn while we still wait for my opponent Confirm timeout to expire.

Anyway, this is becoming wayyyy too ridiculous. I expressed my preference for how the game I loved had always been before the change. But apparently that is not allowed. I will shut up. Whatever. I was done with the game. I am done with this forum now.

[Priptonite]

Not sure how one can argue against the misclick argument when there are cases when a tile in the center is legitimately UNDER a group of other tiles and isn’t clickable. Only option is to select/undo the larger group a few times to get them to move.

That being said I don’t see why it can’t be an option upon table creation like it used to be. Just have to be careful when joining tables.

[Jellby]

That being said I don’t see why it can’t be an option upon table creation like it used to be. Just have to be careful when joining tables.

Because it should be a personal choice on which other players should not have any decision power. You also cannot set a global zoom level, screen layout or interface language.

Just allow any number of trials, undos and confirms (within the time limit), but do not show them to the other players until the final confirmation. Then other players won't know if undo was used or not, and problem solved. Any issue with the playing speed should be addressed by the time settings, table description, red/green thumbs, or player groups, as with any other game.

[franck67000]

That being said I don’t see why it can’t be an option upon table creation like it used to be. Just have to be careful when joining tables.

Because it should be a personal choice on which other players should not have any decision power. You also cannot set a global zoom level, screen layout or interface language.

Just allow any number of trials, undos and confirms (within the time limit), but do not show them to the other players until the final confirmation. Then other players won't know if undo was used or not, and problem solved. Any issue with the playing speed should be addressed by the time settings, table description, red/green thumbs, or player groups, as with any other game.

People still don't see the point. Is is so hard to understand that picturing a move is a help that some don't want to play with and against ?

[Cile]

People still don't see the point. Is is so hard to understand that picturing a move is a help that some don't want to play with and against ?

Is it so hard to understand that misclicks are an aggravation that most people don't want to play with or against?

[Jellby]

Is is so hard to understand that picturing a move is a help that some don't want to play with and against ?

It's just not a fair requirement. It's one of the differences between physical and virtual games. You may also want to not play against people who take notes, but there's no way you can forbid taking notes, so that won't happen.

[X_MIKE_X]

Okay I said I was done… but I had an idea…

First of all, the BGA UNDO POLICY says:
“We may allow a player to undo a move caused by a “misclick”, but we shouldn’t allow a player to undo a bad move he plays consciously.” “Undo are painful for opponents, in real world and online. Some players may also use Undo to “test” situations while they should just think instead.”

That is pretty clear.

Now, I think the most likely area that a misclick can occur is when choosing a tile, especially in the center because they can be stacked almost on top of each other. And I think that rows are big enough to not have a misclick.

So keeping all the above in mind I think there is a solution that would satisfaction both sides here:

1. When the player pick a tile, the undo button appear. And it remains active until the player select the destination row.
2. When the player select the destination row, the move is final and the turn is ended.

This method would allow a safeguard at the exact moment where maybe 99% of misclicks can happen while also eliminating the Confim delay which is what slowed the game since the update (and what I have been vocal about).

I think this solution would work great and actually remove the need for the No-undo/Confirm option altogether.

But I am sure that someone will say “I have hand tremors so I need a full confirm, even at the row destination selection”. So, in that case, what I propose is to instead put an option that is OFF by default but can be enabled by those who really needs it. That option will enable a full turn confirmation. I will be happy to wait for these players.

Is that a good solution?

[stevesie sue]

It's pretty clear now that people don't care about our feedback re: this change. My subscription runs out in January and I won't be renewing. Azul was the game I played most on here and now it's completely unenjoyable.

[Stevemax]

It's pretty clear now that people don't care about our feedback re: this change. My subscription runs out in January and I won't be renewing. Azul was the game I played most on here and now it's completely unenjoyable.

I totally agree with this. Can't believe that user feedback is being ignored in such a way.