What counts as 'significant evidence' for cheating?

[h_illes]

Just one example of my reports that led to moderation - thus was judged as sufficient evidence.

Two players that played 3-player Catan games and played almost exclusively as a team. I gave at least 10 games where this was very obvious and I listed all the dubious moves that I found.
These players traded in a way that one player would have the ressources for a settlement then in a later turn the other could build a city. In the approx. 30 games I looked at
they never (!) ever traded with the 3rd player. They put the robber only onto themselves when the games were already decided. Since one of the two accounts was the main account, the second account sometimes artificially avoided to get the 10th victory point.

Also the initial settlements where highly questionable. They tried to block in the 3rd player completely. And they did not care if the one player had only wood and ore, and the other the other ressources - because they knew they could share their ressources at any time.

Of 30 games the team finished approx. 27 in 1st and 2nd position. My report was 2 A4 pages of questionable moves (with game number and move number).

Thanks, this is somewhat reassuring.

If I suspected someone of engaging in these behaviours I would try to prove that the player in question is doing this in several games. If the second account plays the exact same games as the primary account and begins playing right after the (suspected) main account reached the top or is never playing against the main account, that is an observable pattern, which at least (in my opinion) shouldn't get you in trouble for reporting without significant evidence. The same pattern over several Arena seasons might work too.

Thank you. It would be nice to get an official opinion on the 'shouldn't get you in trouble' part though. Any admins...?

[JQSumners]

How about looking at statistics of players? There are some VERY highly ranked players that have some extremely questionable stats. One player has an average "success rate of trades" that is DOUBLE the average. Another that has played over 300 games of Catan and won 99% of them. Looks like you would start there and dig a little deeper.

[Jellby]

How about looking at statistics of players?

It looks like you have done it. Build a case and report it. Don't expect moderators to investigate every player for suspicious behaviour, they'll only investigate reasonable reports.

[Mr Tibs]

"What counts as 'significance evidence' for cheating?"

On this site, all you need is more than a few players to whine and cry and raise a fuss.

[buu441]

Ouch looks like someone is salty after getting caught and suspended for cheating <3

[h_illes]

Ouch looks like someone is salty after getting caught and suspended for cheating <3

I am not sure I understand this correctly, but if this is a jab at me, well, I never cheated in any way; rather, I have noticed various forms of cheating from others, but I'm not sure how to provide sufficient evidence to report it. That's what this thread is about. If I misunderstood your comment, please elaborate.

[h_illes]

How about looking at statistics of players? There are some VERY highly ranked players that have some extremely questionable stats. One player has an average "success rate of trades" that is DOUBLE the average. Another that has played over 300 games of Catan and won 99% of them. Looks like you would start there and dig a little deeper.

That's a good point, but once again, such an approach should be very careful. If someone is actually strong at a certain game, that might show in some of their stats (that are relevant to winning). I know that for games I'm good at, certain stats differ from the average significantly. That said, those stats should look similar across strong players. Also, I agree that for Catan, double success rate of trades looks very dubious, but is it 'significant evidence'? Or do you also need to point out specific trades in games that are suspect? If yes, how many? 5? 10? 100? It would be nice to have
some admin feedback.

[buu441]

Ouch looks like someone is salty after getting caught and suspended for cheating <3

I am not sure I understand this correctly, but if this is a jab at me, well, I never cheated in any way; rather, I have noticed various forms of cheating from others, but I'm not sure how to provide sufficient evidence to report it. That's what this thread is about. If I misunderstood your comment, please elaborate.

Oh my bad should have quoted the one I'm replying to. It's the comment right above mine, made by a very new account.

[euklid314]

How about looking at statistics of players? There are some VERY highly ranked players that have some extremely questionable stats. One player has an average "success rate of trades" that is DOUBLE the average. Another that has played over 300 games of Catan and won 99% of them. Looks like you would start there and dig a little deeper.

That's a good point, but once again, such an approach should be very careful. If someone is actually strong at a certain game, that might show in some of their stats (that are relevant to winning). I know that for games I'm good at, certain stats differ from the average significantly. That said, those stats should look similar across strong players. Also, I agree that for Catan, double success rate of trades looks very dubious, but is it 'significant evidence'? Or do you also need to point out specific trades in games that are suspect? If yes, how many? 5? 10? 100? It would be nice to have
some admin feedback.

If I see a player with such crazy stats (double success rate of trades, 99% win rate,...) I would look at the most recent 5 games. If I find several fishy moves in those 5 games that explain why the stats are so "wrong" I would report the player and give all the details I find.

It is sufficient evidence for a report and the moderators will surely analyze my report and delve deeper if they are not yet convinced.

Not sufficient is a report that only includes a single game - however strange this game might have been played.

[h_illes]

If I see a player with such crazy stats (double success rate of trades, 99% win rate,...) I would look at the most recent 5 games. If I find several fishy moves in those 5 games that explain why the stats are so "wrong" I would report the player and give all the details I find.

It is sufficient evidence for a report and the moderators will surely analyze my report and delve deeper if they are not yet convinced.

Not sufficient is a report that only includes a single game - however strange this game might have been played.

Thanks. I agree that should be sufficient to catch 2 accounts working together.

And how would you address the following situations?

- sandbagging: creating a new account and playing against other rivals to decrease their rating;
- climbing the rankings with multiple accounts and whenever one reaches a high rank, switch to another one.