Asteroid Mining Consortium

[FrankJones]

I disagree with Jay on gen1 hacker, I think it's perfectly fine to play. -1 vp on gen 1 is meaningless, but 4 MC swing for 9+ gens creates a tremendous deflation effect on your 2p opponents economy, especially they bought lots cards in the initial draft. Delaying one more gen of media group combo decides games, it's simple as that. Money is tempo and if the game goes on to gen 10 it's all gravy for the hacker. Play hacker then dont buy cards fixes the negatives anyway, and the hacker has the right of way during draft.

If money is tempo, what do you think about delaiyng NRA for playing bribed?

Delaying it by THREE generations!

[RoyalRook]

I disagree with Jay on gen1 hacker, I think it's perfectly fine to play. -1 vp on gen 1 is meaningless, but 4 MC swing for 9+ gens creates a tremendous deflation effect on your 2p opponents economy, especially they bought lots cards in the initial draft. Delaying one more gen of media group combo decides games, it's simple as that. Money is tempo and if the game goes on to gen 10 it's all gravy for the hacker. Play hacker then dont buy cards fixes the negatives anyway, and the hacker has the right of way during draft.

If money is tempo, what do you think about delaiyng NRA for playing bribed?

The skill gap was large enough for me to do whatever I want, most likely I wouldn't be challenged so econ and heat control with anti grav in hand. I get to have fun 2 from time to time. Although to be fair, that's usually when I get caught and lose a game b/c I go off the main lines. If closer in skill I will probably just max out gen1 NRA, come on if you can see that line I certainly did.

[FrankJones]

I disagree with Jay on gen1 hacker, I think it's perfectly fine to play. -1 vp on gen 1 is meaningless, but 4 MC swing for 9+ gens creates a tremendous deflation effect on your 2p opponents economy, especially they bought lots cards in the initial draft. Delaying one more gen of media group combo decides games, it's simple as that. Money is tempo and if the game goes on to gen 10 it's all gravy for the hacker. Play hacker then dont buy cards fixes the negatives anyway, and the hacker has the right of way during draft.

If money is tempo, what do you think about delaiyng NRA for playing bribed?

The skill gap was large enough for me to do whatever I want, most likely I wouldn't be challenged so econ and heat control with anti grav in hand. I get to have fun 2 from time to time. Although to be fair, that's usually when I get caught and lose a game b/c I go off the main lines. If closer in skill I will probably just max out gen1 NRA, come on if you can see that line I certainly did.

Overconfidence can lead to unexpected losses !

[RoyalRook]

Anyway, so gen1 hacker, to demonstrate I did this line in my game earlier today: https://boardgamearena.com/table?table=688685606
You got Supplier
You got Polar Industries
You buy House Printing
You buy Titanium Mine
You buy Cartel
You buy Hackers
You buy Sabotage
You buy Business Network
You choose corporation Vitor
Then of course, I found banker. How can you argue that it's not legit against a gen1 12 carder? You gotta play it, and if they tries anything to cover the short you credit squeeze them and make them inefficient and poor. You will be richer even if they manages to win banker later.

One more thing, it's very corp related as well. When you are up against an ecoline, you more than likely need to slow her down. It's the same line of thinking when you buy raider and hit MC(-1 MC), or when Ecoline in turn playing loan(-1 MC prod) or indentured (-1 VP) to boost her tempo. Why wouldn't you want to raider ecoline EVERY generation by playing Hacker? -1 VP and -1 energy prod? I take that deal every time if I know I am up against ecoline. On the other hand, why would you EVER play hacker as ecoline????? You essentially hacker yourself twice by slowing down your tempo, lose a heat prod and -1 VP on top of it, especially after buying it for 3MC, if you get it for free just toss it. Don't even think about keep it for planner, that aren't your life.

P.S. Happy and Frank, the skill level between you and the top players of this game is absolutely stupendous. Even if you manage to win a game against one by 10+ points, it's actually a galaxy away. And there is no such thing about:"oh had I tried, I would be the best, I am just not that dedicated."

[FrankJones]

Agreed. I'm playing Hackers there for sure.

[HappyMeaI]

Anyway, so gen1 hacker, to demonstrate I did this line in my game earlier today: https://boardgamearena.com/table?table=688685606
You got Supplier
You got Polar Industries
You buy House Printing
You buy Titanium Mine
You buy Cartel
You buy Hackers
You buy Sabotage
You buy Business Network
You choose corporation Vitor
Then of course, I found banker. How can you argue that it's not legit against a gen1 12 carder? You gotta play it, and if they tries anything to cover the short you credit squeeze them and make them inefficient and poor. You will be richer even if they manages to win banker later.

One more thing, it's very corp related as well. When you are up against an ecoline, you more than likely need to slow her down. It's the same line of thinking when you buy raider and hit MC(-1 MC), or when Ecoline in turn playing loan(-1 MC prod) or indentured (-1 VP) to boost her tempo. Why wouldn't you want to raider ecoline EVERY generation by playing Hacker? -1 VP and -1 energy prod? I take that deal every time if I know I am up against ecoline. On the other hand, why would you EVER play hacker as ecoline????? You essentially hacker yourself twice by slowing down your tempo, lose a heat prod and -1 VP on top of it, especially after buying it for 3MC, if you get it for free just toss it. Don't even think about keep it for planner, that aren't your life.

P.S. Happy and Frank, the skill level between you and the top players of this game is absolutely stupendous. Even if you manage to win a game against one by 10+ points, it's actually a galaxy away. And there is no such thing about:"oh had I tried, I would be the best, I am just not that dedicated."

Curious why wouldn’t you take Phobos Station here? You have Vitor and can play all the other cards gen1. I might even skip Polar and take self settlement w phobos to have a head start on mayor. I know you could use 2 cards, but the devil we know is generally preferred over the devil we don’t, and while having 2 heat prod is nice here gen 1, heat trappers would make you cry. Getting the 2 cards bonus is also not gtd here. Polar just stinks overall.

I may even take donations just to get phobos down gen 1 and a 2nd tit production.

As for your P.S, I’ve already managed to take games off of several 6-700 elo players. It wasn’t hard. This game is not as complex as you think. Sometimes your hand is an easy one to play. Sometimes it’s complex in its own way. That depends on your leaks. We all have them. Yours is fps (fancy-play-syndrome), where it tends to cost you the game from time to time because instead of the obvious route, you stray the path to try and impress yourself.

We still have to finish our series btw. Not so sure our 1st game would’ve turned out the same had you not magically procured AI.

[FrankJones]

P.S. Happy and Frank, the skill level between you and the top players of this game is absolutely stupendous. Even if you manage to win a game against one by 10+ points, it's actually a galaxy away. And there is no such thing about:"oh had I tried, I would be the best, I am just not that dedicated."

Yeah, that's just not accurate.

You have shown literally nothing in any of your posted games to justify telling me my skill level is stupendously lower than the "top players".

Your game in which you played Bribed committee in gen 1 instead of NRA was laughable. What was your reasoning? "Oh, I knew I would win anyway so it did not matter."

No.

[Kulikk]

I disagree with Jay on gen1 hacker, I think it's perfectly fine to play. -1 vp on gen 1 is meaningless, but 4 MC swing for 9+ gens creates a tremendous deflation effect on your 2p opponents economy, especially they bought lots cards in the initial draft. Delaying one more gen of media group combo decides games, it's simple as that. Money is tempo and if the game goes on to gen 10 it's all gravy for the hacker. Play hacker then dont buy cards fixes the negatives anyway, and the hacker has the right of way during draft.

If money is tempo, what do you think about delaiyng NRA for playing bribed?

The skill gap was large enough for me to do whatever I want, most likely I wouldn't be challenged so econ and heat control with anti grav in hand. I get to have fun 2 from time to time. Although to be fair, that's usually when I get caught and lose a game b/c I go off the main lines. If closer in skill I will probably just max out gen1 NRA, come on if you can see that line I certainly did.

That's funny because I would bet on Pkoo beating you in a bo5

[Joost1987]

Anyway, so gen1 hacker, to demonstrate I did this line in my game earlier today: https://boardgamearena.com/table?table=688685606
You got Supplier
You got Polar Industries
You buy House Printing
You buy Titanium Mine
You buy Cartel
You buy Hackers
You buy Sabotage
You buy Business Network
You choose corporation Vitor
Then of course, I found banker. How can you argue that it's not legit against a gen1 12 carder? You gotta play it, and if they tries anything to cover the short you credit squeeze them and make them inefficient and poor. You will be richer even if they manages to win banker later.

One more thing, it's very corp related as well. When you are up against an ecoline, you more than likely need to slow her down. It's the same line of thinking when you buy raider and hit MC(-1 MC), or when Ecoline in turn playing loan(-1 MC prod) or indentured (-1 VP) to boost her tempo. Why wouldn't you want to raider ecoline EVERY generation by playing Hacker? -1 VP and -1 energy prod? I take that deal every time if I know I am up against ecoline. On the other hand, why would you EVER play hacker as ecoline????? You essentially hacker yourself twice by slowing down your tempo, lose a heat prod and -1 VP on top of it, especially after buying it for 3MC, if you get it for free just toss it. Don't even think about keep it for planner, that aren't your life.

P.S. Happy and Frank, the skill level between you and the top players of this game is absolutely stupendous. Even if you manage to win a game against one by 10+ points, it's actually a galaxy away. And there is no such thing about:"oh had I tried, I would be the best, I am just not that dedicated."

Curious why wouldn’t you take Phobos Station here? You have Vitor and can play all the other cards gen1. I might even skip Polar and take self settlement w phobos to have a head start on mayor. I know you could use 2 cards, but the devil we know is generally preferred over the devil we don’t, and while having 2 heat prod is nice here gen 1, heat trappers would make you cry. Getting the 2 cards bonus is also not gtd here. Polar just stinks overall.

I may even take donations just to get phobos down gen 1 and a 2nd tit production.

As for your P.S, I’ve already managed to take games off of several 6-700 elo players. It wasn’t hard. This game is not as complex as you think. Sometimes your hand is an easy one to play. Sometimes it’s complex in its own way. That depends on your leaks. We all have them. Yours is fps (fancy-play-syndrome), where it tends to cost you the game from time to time because instead of the obvious route, you stray the path to try and impress yourself.

We still have to finish our series btw. Not so sure our 1st game would’ve turned out the same had you not magically procured AI.

Phobos might be the last card I would consider in that hand. You overpay 15 MC of early cash in exchange for 3 points (which don't do a whole lot in the beginning of the game) and the possibility of getting mayor, which is - in my opinion - a strategic mistake. Taking Phobos for that reason leads you to taking an inferior prelude (self sustaining settlement) and commits you to building a 3rd city somewhere in the near future. Sounds like a really bad deal to me.

@ RoyalRook: I agree with most of your picks - even hackers - but would not take Polar Industries. I would take donation instead, because you were not the starting player. The chance of your opponent playing a watertile prelude before you, for 2-card tile, is quite large and on top of that you might help him if he would have algae and/or kelp farming in hand.

[FrankJones]

Much of the strategy analysis (if we can call it that) for this game seems to revolve around arguing over the value of some of the cards.
In this thread, a debate over how strong AMC is, and whether hackers is worth playing. In another thread, a debate over the moss cards.

Even if we all came to an agreement on which cards were worth what, there would still be high variance with regard to who gets dealt which cards.

To demonstrate the complexity of the game, if it is in fact a high-complexity game, maybe some top players can post games in which they won a game with bad cards by out-maneuvering the opponent.