Reduce last Player's disadvantage => Choose of colour

[Jack0815xxx]

In my opinion out of playing hundreds of games, first player(s) are having an advantage of getting best position and having the best chance to use his/her colour in the best way.

Example:
In a game with 4 players if you are 4th player you sometimes get no chance either to howl or build a den cause your colour is out of range to do so. You are forced to move first and lose a half turn additional to the fact that the other players had the chance to howl/build den.

My suggestion to improve this, would be, that 4th player get the chance to choose colour first, than 3rd player etc.

[The Recogniser]

Great idea, Jack. I thought about this but seems like the 1st player always have good spot regardless of their color.
My idea is to give the last player a bonus turn token to use immediately in 1st turn. That token would be overpower if being saved for later turn so maybe using 1st turn wouldn't affect much.
Another Idea is to allow the last player to have pack of 3, or speed of 4, or howl of 3, at 1st turn only.

[Jack0815xxx]

Appriciate your Feedback @Recogniser!

I guess this could work in a 3 Player Game. I think in a 4 Player Game there need also be an advantage for the 3rd Player.

I really don't know how or what could make that game more balanced, especially if there are 3 or 4 high level players...

[CasperDS]

I like this suggestion a lot, Jack. Playing IRL, we're already using this as house rule even, with good succes.
That the first player still has the advantage will still be the case, but it would get a bit more balanced and is not complicated.
To me, giving out giving out a bonus or extra turn in a 4 or 5-player game to the last player then disfavors the before-last player. Granting extra movement/spread/howl distance for the first turn is a good in between, although introduces some extra complexity.

[Jack0815xxx]

Thanks for you feedback @Casper!

I am with you, there will still be an advantage for the 1st player, but it will not be that much as it is now...

Maybe the developers may add that option - or at least to overthink this...?

@xiongmao1298
@Coolroo

[The Recogniser]

Let's say the early upgrade, pack = speed > howl, so to not let the 3rd player have no power and the 4th player have all the "balance benefit", I have another idea: In the 1st turn, the 3rd player can have howl range upgrade only in 1st action, the 4th player can have howl range upgrade in 1st and 2nd action (still in the 1st turn). The 5th player is same as the 4th.
After the 1st turn, all the howl upgrades of the 3rd and 4th player return to starting point.
If upgrade the terrain, the 3rd and 4th will dominate early which will destroy 1st and 2nd player game. If upgrade the pack or speed, I guess they'll hunt too effective before 2nd turn. So the howl upgrade is best for balancing, in my opinion.

[manderism]

After conversing briefly with Jack about this at the end of a game, where I mentioned turn order is unbalanced and he pointed me to this thread... here were my possible ideas:

* In 2 and 3 player games, the first player should get only one action in the first round; in 4 and 5 player games, the first two players should only get one action in the first round.

--- In 3 and 5 player games, perhaps the last player is *still* at a disadvantage; perhaps this can be made up by giving them one, special, any-time Wild that can be used for any action Except dominate.

* Another smaller fix to the turn-order imblance would be to reverse the order in which wolves are placed at the beginning. Let the last player place the first Alpha wolf, and also the last Alpha wolf; and then the first player gets the two Alphas in the middle of the placement rounds.

[Tholin_]

The idea, that the last player chooses colour first, than the second last and so on, is great. There should be a rule adjustment to the 3-5 player game. Would be a nescessary step to balance the game.

[jwandke]

Nice.

Post to bgg, too, to share these ideas and increase the chance the original developers see them too.