Just curious - do you think it is possible to 'get good' at this game?

[Watoop]

I've played nearly 800 games of this - it's a fun game. However my ELO has been up over 400 and just bounces back and forth down to 200 and up again.
I don't feel I play any differently on games where I win or where I lose. For instance in my last 10 player game, I lost early by some margin as virtually every card I played happened to hit on the 'take 6 spot', with cards -1 and +1 either side of it played by other players and avoiding penalty.
There are obviously some skills you can learn to avoid mistakes but is this game really something that has such a high random factor that you can never really consistently 'get better' once you've reached a level of 'competency' ?
I agree that players in the 3-400s will usually beat players in 100s but in games where you have 200-400 ranked players, it just seems like anyone's game.
I'd just be interested in any other players' thoughts on this. I'm not knocking the game but I do wonder whether there is any real skill involved when you are playing with a table of competent players.
PS I know there are professional / tactics variants etc but I prefer the 'purity' of the standard game.

[Strode]

I think there are several different levels of play here - if nothing else, you just develop a sense of how a position will likely play out. Pattern recognition is big.

But it's not Chess or Go. 6 Nimmt is a popular game here, and most who have played hundreds of times have probably mastered the standard game. Lots of "experienced players in your point range. So you end up just swapping points back and forth.

If you only played against people much higher rated than you, would you (a) never win or (b) benefit from the randomness and gain points? I think (b) is at least partly true.

[Wreckage]

If you stick to the “normal” variant, you will master most of the basics in relatively few games. You might have more to learn about how to mitigate losses.

You said you are playing 10p games. With that many players the game is extremely random, and you shouldn’t expect better than average results. 5 players is the sweet spot and has the most skill. You can learn to “get control” of the table. Trying to end an expensive row with a certain card to steer everyone else to try to avoid it the rest of the hand, it's a better strategy than just playing your safest card each turn.

Also, play with “tactics” on, and keep track of what cards have played. Keeping track is the biggest advantage you can have.

I know you like the basic game, but pro/tactics has a LOT more strategy. At first it will seem like chaos, because you’re so used to normal. Normal is very easy to master. For most of the turns in normal, all 5 players play on the same row, and you know which row that will be. Usually, at some point every hand all players start playing their hand from largest to smallest. The strategy is somewhat limited, and straight forward.

Pro, is a lot more dynamic, with players playing on all 4 rows quite often. Each hand plays differently. Predicting what others will play becomes more of a skill. Using early plays to set up expensive rows can affect how every player plays the rest of the hand. Having the “1” doesn’t mean you must take a row. Having the highest card isn’t as much of a disaster either.

Btw, playing 10 player games is the worst for gaining elo. There is basically an elo penalty for each additional player in your game. For example, if you have 300 elo, and everyone at your table also has 300 elo, a victory for beating 9 opponents will gain about 25 elo. If you have a victory at a 5p table wit the same level opponents you will also gain about 25 elo for beating 4 opponents. The elo distribution at different player counts is incredibly unfair.

[3p1cFr3nzy]

All the points here are valid. Main thing for myself in particular is pattern recognition especially in the tactics and professional variant, where tactics definitely adds more skill since you can plan ahead a bit better.

That being said, 2 player grinders are at the top because its the least random but imo not as fun. 6 player games and above you can just get unlucky and be the 6th card when everyone plays on the same row which happens a ton and Im not a fan at all of 6p normal due to the fact that high number hands just kill you it seems no matter what.

Main thing is to have fun

[CameronHamill]

Do you think playing the tactics variant will help build skill in the basic game with 5 players? More often than not I finish with negative points in either the 3rd or 4th round. I've been practicing on the 6 nimmt! app and thought I was improving. But when I 'go live' against people I can't seem to perform. Quite frustrating for me because it's a great game.

[Wreckage]

2 player grinders are at the top because its the least random but imo not as fun.

While it's true that 2p games have less luck, they also have significantly less skill. It is simply a much less interesting game in all respects, at least that's my opinion.

In 5p, you have to plan farther ahead each turn. Making predictions, and balancing that with assessing dangers and values of multiple rows takes much more skill to master when 4 opponent's cards are played simultaneously each turn.

Do you think playing the tactics variant will help build skill in the basic game with 5 players?

Keeping track of what cards have played is the single best advantage you can have. In the normal variant, I think keeping track of the highest cards is most helpful. In pro variant, keeping track of the lowest cards is most important. With tactics off, keeping track is not very important.

If other players are keeping track better than you are, it would be best to leave tactics off, so that nobody knows what cards might be in the deck. But, if you want the most improvement to your game, turn tactics on, and keep track of the cards.

[CameronHamill]

Thanks very much for your reply and suggestions Wreckage! They're very helpful to me and I appreciate your insights.

I have the Android App which I will practice on against AI before continuing to play against Human players. It has standard and pro variants. I suppose it will not mimic human play perfectly of course.

[rashellie7]

If you’ve had your elo reach 400, idk how much better you can be as a player

[CameronHamill]

Not directly related to Watoop's question but I thought that Emiliano Sciarra, the designer of the BANG! and Samurai Sword series of card games, summed up 6 nimmt! perfectly when he described the game as 'neither trivial or boring' in a YouTube interview I saw of him.

I'm not sure exactly what he means by the quote. Maybe in terms of mastering it? But I often think of his statement when I play the game. I'd be interested in trying to find out exactly what he means by the statement actually. If he can expand on it.

If anyone is interested in the interview with him on YouTube it's titled: 'Interview with Emiliano Sciarra' on the Club de Juegos Rosario channel. In Italian with English subtitles.