cheats quoridor

[ophum1234]

So many smurf accounts in quoridor

The* players right now only have 400-500 elo. Nevertheless, very few games played to reach that ELO. That leaves three possibilities
1) They've become good at the game very quickly (I doubt it)
2) They're copying AI
3) They have multiple accounts and may be kingmaking/collaborating

AI cheats? What's going on?





*Moderation Edit: please do not use the Forums to call out specific tables or players by name, this is what the Moderation Reports are for. The Forums should remain a general discussion.

[Ceaseless]

Starting up with a false dilemma followed by minimal evidence of research. Should be fun.

[ophum1234]

"dilemma" is the wrong word.
You don't find it suspicious that players are experts or near experts after fewer than 200 games?

[Jellby]

Suspicious, maybe, but hardly any evidence or sign of cheating.

They could be experienced players (with the physical game or in other platforms) that just came to BGA. They could be a new account of an old member. The reasons for creating a new account could range from benign (forgot password, wants to start "from scratch") to TOS-breaking (bypass moderation, keep several identities) without necessarily cheating as you mean it. And they could simply be smart players that grasped the game quickly.

There could of course be cheating involved, but for that you need better evidence (clearly rigged games against the same opponents, etc.) and report it through the proper channels and not in the forum.

[ophum1234]

I have reported it again and again and again. The smurf accounts keep coming back
You don't get to tell me what I can and can't put on the forum, thanks.

I have the evidence and have had a number of players' accounts suspended.
Then another genius account springs up playing best possible move every time.

Experienced players playing with smurf accounts is essentially cheating because
1) they are protecting their main accounts from losses
2) They are unfairly manipulating ELO
3) they are obviously collaborating on arena

If I play a master and lose, I lose 4 ELO
If I lose to a master smurf with 100 ELO, I lose 15 ELO. This is unfair.

*, just disqualified, account deleted, was at the top of arena. HE deliberately lost 3 or 4 games to the current top-ranked player.
Would you like to see the evidence?

Also, I've watched so many games where a suspicious account is playing and had the AI quoridor program open at the same time. After about 8 moves the cheat starts copying AI move for move. Coincidence? No.

*Moderation Edit: please do not use the Forums to call out specific tables or players by name, this is what the Moderation Reports are for. The Forums should remain a general discussion.

[Strode]

Experienced players playing with smurf accounts is essentially cheating because
1) they are protecting their main accounts from losses
2) They are unfairly manipulating ELO
3) they are obviously collaborating on arena

It is NOT cheating for an experienced player - e.g., for someone who owns the game and has played offline a lot - to play in Arena.

Your complaint about collaboration and false accounts may be true, I can't say, but you're wrong about this.

[ophum1234]

You're right. That isn't cheating, in theory, just as me beating Magnus Carlson at chess isn't cheating if I somehow manage to get relaly good playing against my friends.

But you can't become the best online against the best in the world by playing against your friends.
There's a difference between theory and empiricl reality.

You don't get to beat the best on quoridor without playing them for hundreds of games online.

Trust me. It's the same cheats again and again, with smurf accounts an AI cheating.
The many-headed hydra, once disqualified by moderators pops up again and again with new accounts.
Golden Garden
*
*
etc
etc
All the "best" in their time, now gone. Disqualified.

I watch them play. Some mirror AI EXACTLY. EXACTLY.

Anyway, I have evidence.

These players were number one and two/three when these games were played.
* gives up for no apparent reason. This is collaboration and CHEATING.

*
*
*
*

If you watch some of the "top" players in arena playing, open
** and watch the cheat copy Ishtar move for move after about 8 moves, until they're in an unassailable position.

Enough evidence for you?

*Moderation Edit: please do not use the Forums to call out specific tables or players by name, this is what the Moderation Reports are for. The Forums should remain a general discussion.
** *Moderator edit: please do not specifically name or link other gaming platforms or cheating services

[Strode]

The problem is, if anyone from BGA sees your complaint here, you're going to get dinged for naming names.

[Ceaseless]

"dilemma" is the wrong word.
You don't find it suspicious that players are experts or near experts after fewer than 200 games?

It might catch my attention, but it won't put me right into the false dilemma you presented. BGA calls an expert, what, 500 rating? I have side games I play at 500 rating: it's not top-level material. What you described in your first post would justify "oh, that's curious, let's take a look". You haven't even confirmed it's fewer than 200 games, at best you can say they've played fewer than 200 on that account, but that doesn't account for IRL play.

You're right. That isn't cheating, in theory, just as me beating Magnus Carlson at chess isn't cheating if I somehow manage to get relaly good playing against my friends.

You are not Magnus Carlsen, and neither are the other Quoridor players on BGA, lol. This is a nondedicated Quoridor site with fairly low activity for this game. And of all things, you want to use Arena as your comparison point? You have what, 7 players right now? If I bother to count non-elite, the arena only lists 34 players exist, and 19 of them are 0 bronze, lol.

As for whether or not a given player is cheating, that's a separate story. Your original post being wrong doesn't mean they aren't cheating, just that said post isn't giving good enough evidence that they are. There we follow the good old fashioned send evidence to moderators to get them moderated, etc.

[ophum1234]

A cursory glance at the top players on arena would show you that the top two players have played 200 games.

It's not a false dilemma.
That means an unnecessary binary choice.
Try to understand the words you use before posting.
I have provided evidence in the thread and informed the moderators.
Your contribution is less than worthless.