Losing accomplished goals vs end of game?

[kajter]

Hello All,

I noticed that goals resetting is not consistent during the match and when the end-of-game is triggered:
- during the match accomplished goals are reset when the condition is no longer met, in particular 8-cards bonus: you place manta with 8 cards on hand, but if you have only 7 later then manta gets back to your pool;
- when the end-of-game is triggered accomplished goals seem "fixed", no mantas will be removed from goals even when conditions are no longer met after the last turn; for example: 8-cards hand & 5-location goals are still counted even if after the last round player has less than 8 cards on hand and less than 5 locations on his board;

If I am not wrong manual does not mention this goal losing mechanic at all. Nor that it works differently during the match and at the end.
Is this implemented wrongly (bug) or is it intended?

[FrankJones]

I have never seen this happen. Do you have a table number?

[FrankJones]

I reviewed your most recent game and saw no occurrences of this.

[FrankJones]

It did not happen in your other game either.

I think you are misunderstanding how the goals work.

You must claim the goal and place a manta. For the goals that involve a specific game state, such as "have 5 locations" or "have 8 character cards in your hand", you can only claim it while the condition is true.

If you do not claim it, you can still claim it halter, but only if you re-attain that game condition.

The other two goals, "have 3 scored locations" and "have 2 wild mantas", can be claimed at any time, because once you have those conditions met, you always will.

[kajter]

The 8-card goal reset I saw it happened twice - once for me and once for my opponent. But perhaps for some reason you cannot see it in the game replay. I will also check it - if the replay will be still available. If not - I will try to recreate it during the match I currently play.

In the meantime I have question what was the intented implementation of the goals mechanic:

You start your turn, you have 8 cards.
You put your manta on 8-card goal.
During your turn you play 1 card, 7 cards are left at the end of your turn.

What should happen with 8-card goal manta at the end of your turn? Should it stay and count goal for you? Or should it get back to you, because to score goal you need to have 8+ cards at the END of your turn?

[FrankJones]

The 8-card goal reset I saw it happened twice - once for me and once for my opponent. But perhaps for some reason you cannot see it in the game replay. I will also check it - if the replay will be still available. If not - I will try to recreate it during the match I currently play.

In the meantime I have question what was the intented implementation of the goals mechanic:

You start your turn, you have 8 cards.
You put your manta on 8-card goal.
During your turn you play 1 card, 7 cards are left at the end of your turn.

What should happen with 8-card goal manta at the end of your turn? Should it stay and count goal for you? Or should it get back to you, because to score goal you need to have 8+ cards at the END of your turn?

Once you place a manta and confirm end of turn, you have the goal. The manta never returns to your board, and the goal points are never lost.

So, here's what I saw during the replays (I watched both of your games):

You met the criteria for the goal(s), causing the goal circle to glow and flash - but did not actually claim the goal by placing a manta.
Later, the condition was no longer met, which means the goal cannot be claimed, and the goal circle no longer glows or flashes.

Are you saying you claimed the goal by selecting and placing a personal manta, confirmed the end of turn, no longer had the manta in your supply, and had the manta on the goal board, but then all that came undone later? Because, I have never seen that (and it does not show on the replay), and that would be a severe bug.

[kajter]

I just revieved my first game - table number 762143161.
Indeed the log is not showing this effect, but I am sure that I did it: I scored 8-card goal by placing manta on it, but when I finished my turn manta came back to me (which I explained to myself that it was because I was no longer having 8 cards AFTER my turn).

It was in the middle of the game, I believe it happened at or around the time stamp where you can see in the log (during my turn):
1923 cancels their move
1923 cancels their move
Indeed match-replay does not show that I placed manta on the 8-card goal, but I know that I did. I was very surprised that it came back to me for the next turn and concluded that apparently you have to maintain 8-cards on hand not to lose this goal after it is secured. So I waited till end of the game and scored this 8-card goal once again at the very end (which is visible in the replay).

I understand from your response that manta should never come back to hand from the goal, once the goal is secured with manta, correct?

[kajter]

One thing I am not sure now is how it was with this turn cancelling.
Perhaps I overlooked that I intentionally cancelled my turn when manta was placed on 8-card goal hmm.
I will try in my current match to recreate it - what happens if I score 8-cards goal and next turn have only 7 cards on hand.

[FrankJones]

I see several instances of "kajter cancels their move" in the game log.

If you reset your turn, it resets your entire turn. Which means you would have your manta back and would not have the goal. That is likely what happened.

If you reset your turn, you would need to claim the goal again.

[FrankJones]

I will try in my current match to recreate it - what happens if I score 8-cards goal and next turn have only 7 cards on hand.

Notice, I answered this in my first sentence of my previous post in which I quoted your post.

You do not need to permanently have the goal condition met for "8 cards in hand" or "5 locations on the player board". If that were the case, you would never be able to score locations or play more characters without losing the goal, which is nonsense.

As I said - once claimed, a goal is never lost.

You've already figured out what happened. You were resetting your turn without realizing that meant resetting the claiming of the goal. The game is not going to atomically claim the goal again for you. It's just computer code; it cannot make decisions for you (obviously ), and for all it knows, you may have been resetting your turn because you wanted to use a different personal manta for the goal, or may have wanted to delay claiming the goal altogether.

So, when you reset your turn, it will reset to the beginning of the entire turn (Not just the last move), or, if any facedown cards were revealed or an opponent action was taken, it will reset to that point.