Arena settings

[Exotic Dreams]

I am not a guru for this game. Could I ask why for lack of better terms, the one tile mode is being selected?.
I played one game last arena season for this game and then quit playing because I don't find the game fun without being able to choose between different tiles to play.
I got into queue to try it again this arena season and the one tile mode is still there. So this means the gurus for this game like it this way and selected it again. Which is fine since if this setting is popular with others. I'll play other games instead of this. I have plenty to pick from so dropping games is not a problem for me. Just curious why.

[FrankJones]

I am not a guru for this game. Could I ask why for lack of better terms, the one tile mode is being selected?.
I played one game last arena season for this game and ten quit playing because I don't find the game fun without being able to choose between different tiles to play.
I got into queue to try it again this arena season and the one tile mode is still there. So this means the gurus for this game like it this way and selected it again. Which is fine since if this setting is popular wit others. I'll play other games instead of this. I have plenty to pick from so dropping games is not a problem for me. Just curious why.

I find this unfathomable. (meaning, I agree with you.)

Even with 3 tiles to chose form, I sometimes go 15 turns without a useful tile. What skill game places such heavy restrictions on available actions to fore a player to play ONE tile? How do you plan, strategize?

SIDE NOTE : I think I am 18-1 in Carcassonne, or something like that.

[suprisefish]

If you’re going 15 tiles without finding something useful then you’re not making maximum use of your tiles. For most lower rated players this is because they don’t play aggressively enough to try to block the opponent’s meeples (e.g. road tiles are often more useful for blocking than for scoring).

Also part of the skill of the game is keeping a board state where you always have a use for every type of tile (and of course knowing what tiles are still in the bag that you can use). This is something I’m not that good at but top players do it really well.

The fact that the top players are over 800 elo only playing with single tile draw shows that it is quite a high skill game.

Alexey’s carcassonne channel on YouTube has very good content about how to improve.

[Exotic Dreams]

Thanks for the suggestion on videos for playing better. My problem with that game is generally I play games that fit a couple of criteria:
1-Simple. Win or lose, the game is simple enough to make a move quickly without much thinking. If I keep on losing, I haven't invested much into the game to begin with.
2- Fun. That is I'm still having fun playing the game even if I'm losing games.
3- I am winning enough games to make the effort worthwhile. I'm still getting the satisfaction of scoring points, winning games and or making progress.
4- Some kind of challenge to figure out in the gameplay.


Here's why Carcassonne without being able to choose a tile doesn't fit into these criteria for me for arena play.

1- This is not a simple game to me. It takes effort/thinking to find a move to make.
2- This game is not fun enough to keep on losing.
3- I'm not winning any games to make playing this game in arena mode worthwhile.
4- This game is mostly like putting together a puzzle. The parts either fit somewhere or they don't.

I am still mostly losing when I get to pick from three tiles, but at least then it's a more fun game to lose at. Being able to choose between the three tiles makes this game fun enough to play despite losing a lot.

[notnewatthis]

Arena is a competitive setting of a given game. Imo, considering the whole competitive scene around Carcassonne it only makes sense that arena is played with the globally played competitive setting.

Carcassonne national championships and world cup are played with this configuration.

Adding on top of that:
National team competitions (world championship and continental level competitions), Carcassonne champions league, Mind Sport Olympiad and maybe others I don't remember right now.

Custom games are there for people to play with the settings they prefer (within existing options).

Disclaimer: I am a competitive Carcassonne player

[Exotic Dreams]

Arena is a competitive setting of a given game. Imo, considering the whole competitive scene around Carcassonne it only makes sense that arena is played with the globally played competitive setting.

Carcassonne national championships and world cup are played with this configuration.

Adding on top of that:
National team competitions (world championship and continental level competitions), Carcassonne champions league, Mind Sport Olympiad and maybe others I don't remember right now.

Custom games are there for people to play with the settings they prefer (within existing options).

Disclaimer: I am a competitive Carcassonne player

Ah gotcha. Appreciate your input on this issue. I am not familiar with the globally played competitive setting.

[Ceaseless]

Arena is a competitive setting of a given game. Imo, considering the whole competitive scene around Carcassonne it only makes sense that arena is played with the globally played competitive setting.

Carcassonne national championships and world cup are played with this configuration.

Adding on top of that:
National team competitions (world championship and continental level competitions), Carcassonne champions league, Mind Sport Olympiad and maybe others I don't remember right now.

Custom games are there for people to play with the settings they prefer (within existing options).

Disclaimer: I am a competitive Carcassonne player

There's a second question here that I think some people would also be interested in the answer to. Why is the 1-tile system used over the 3-tile system in the first place? Sure, BGA copies other places for consistency answers it for BGA, but playstyle-wise why is it preferred competitively? With 3-tiles one might think having more options increases the skill of the game, reducing bricky topdecks and giving players more control over things like sequencing, etc. This frequently increases the skill of games, yet presumably this is not the case for Carcassonne. So the question then leads to what makes Carcassonne different?

[FrankJones]

If you’re going 15 tiles without finding something useful then you’re not making maximum use of your tiles. For most lower rated players this is because they don’t play aggressively enough to try to block the opponent’s meeples (e.g. road tiles are often more useful for blocking than for scoring).

Also part of the skill of the game is keeping a board state where you always have a use for every type of tile (and of course knowing what tiles are still in the bag that you can use). This is something I’m not that good at but top players do it really well.

The fact that the top players are over 800 elo only playing with single tile draw shows that it is quite a high skill game.

Alexey’s carcassonne channel on YouTube has very good content about how to improve.

Maybe I should have said "very occasionally" rather than "sometimes".

Am I a "low rated player"? I have no idea. I'm 12-1 with an Elo of 306 in rated games, and I think 7-1 in friendly mode games. But I have no idea what my true rating is. It's very possible I might get stuck at 350 or 400. I don't know the game well enough yet.

Regarding blocking - I block very aggressively. If anything, maybe too much. That's what I was alluding to. Sometimes I have made some block attempts and also been blocked by my opponent, to the point where I desperately need to get a meeple back, and cannot, because I keep drawing tiles that are no help. Despite there being a large number of tiles that would help me.

And, if I cannot even see my next 2 tiles, it makes it that much harder to accomplish. Sometimes a 2-move sequence is needed.

That being said, I am aware that high Elo players play single tile, and my understanding is that the highest levels of championship play are also played that way.

That's enough to convince me that single tile is fine - it's just not a version of the game I would actually enjoy.
(I'm never going to try to argue that 800-ELo players are playing the game wrong; that would be rather silly, and I get agitated when I am on the other side of it - having low Elo players tell me my strategy or strategy advice is bad in games in which I am high-rated.)

I suppose what I was trying to say is, I find the 3-tile variant frustrating at times, so I expect I would find single tile even more frustrating.

[FrankJones]

Arena is a competitive setting of a given game. Imo, considering the whole competitive scene around Carcassonne it only makes sense that arena is played with the globally played competitive setting.

Carcassonne national championships and world cup are played with this configuration.

Adding on top of that:
National team competitions (world championship and continental level competitions), Carcassonne champions league, Mind Sport Olympiad and maybe others I don't remember right now.

Custom games are there for people to play with the settings they prefer (within existing options).

Disclaimer: I am a competitive Carcassonne player

There's a second question here that I think some people would also be interested in the answer to. Why is the 1-tile system used over the 3-tile system in the first place? Sure, BGA copies other places for consistency answers it for BGA, but playstyle-wise why is it preferred competitively? With 3-tiles one might think having more options increases the skill of the game, reducing bricky topdecks and giving players more control over things like sequencing, etc. This frequently increases the skill of games, yet presumably this is not the case for Carcassonne. So the question then leads to what makes Carcassonne different?

Excellent question.

I too would think that expanding the decision space would make for a more complex game and more skill-based game.
(Drafting in Terraforming Mars, for example).

It would be helpful, perhaps, to hear WHY single-tile is more skill-based rather than just being reminded that it is.

[suprisefish]

I think the reason why single tile is more commonly played is just that it is how the game was originally intended to be played, and it’s a good game. All official tournaments are played with the official rules of the game so there isn’t a strong incentive for people to practice playing some other variant. I haven’t played enough of the 3 tile variant to know if it’s higher or lower skill, but it’s undoubtedly a different game.

Carcassonne on BGA is quite unusual in implementing a non-official variant of the game (3 tile draw). I think most games on BGA only implement the official rules.