Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

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FastRacoon1
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Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by FastRacoon1 »

In most other games, you have to think first and then move. Why are move takebacks allowed in Santorini? It slows down the game and creates an unfair advantage for those who abuse this option.

Moreover, this feature encourages Analysis Paralysis (AP). Instead of calculating the move in their head, players use 'undo' to test every possible outcome on the board. This ruins the flow of the game and makes matches unnecessarily long.

Removing or limiting this feature would greatly improve the competitive integrity of the game. It would force players to rely on their skills rather than trial and error. I hope BGA consider this change to make the game more professional and enjoyable for everyone.
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Meeplelowda
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Meeplelowda »

FastRacoon1 wrote: 12 February 2026, 20:24 In most other games, you have to think first and then move.
You are cutting against the grain on this issue. Undo is pretty much the most requested feature on EVERY SINGLE GAME RELEASED ON BGA. Within microseconds of a game being released, if there isn't an undo feature there will be someone asking for it. Think I'm exaggerating? Maybe about the microseconds part, but go to Advanced Search, then search for "undo" and filter by search terms in the topic title only. The first page of 259 hits is shown at the end of this post.

Fortunately for you, it doesn't really matter how much people cry about it. It is up to each individual game developer (and I suppose the rights owner if the developer is getting paid) whether to implement undo. Here is one dev's explanation of reasons NOT to have undo:
Kayvon wrote: 26 February 2024, 16:17
Leard wrote: 18 December 2023, 14:27 Why are the inclusion of undo buttons so random and sporadic over the games on here?
Undo needs to be implemented individually for every game. It's not a box you check to just make it happen. Furthermore, undo is tricky to implement correctly and very bug prone. As such, it's often avoided by game developers.
Leard wrote: 18 December 2023, 14:27Either commit to allowing rectons to be made, or ban them over the entire site unless a game specifically allows for it in the rules.
Wish granted?
Official BGA policy states that undo should be avoided in games.
"As a rule of thumb, on BGA we advise you to not undo moves. Undo are painful for opponents, in real world and online. Some players may also use Undo to 'test' situations while they should just think instead. In many cases, proposing an 'Undo' means also adding an extra step, which is not good for the game interface."
See https://boardgamearena.com/doc/BGA_Undo_policy
Leard wrote: 18 December 2023, 14:27Since BGA seems to be going to allowing them, why doesn't this game have one?
In summary:
1) Undo isn't encouraged
2) And it's not trivial to implement

I developed Gaia Project and got a similar request. I don't want to volunteer a dozen hours to implement a feature that I don't feel is needed and may introduce tons of bugs.
Unfortunately for you, because it takes so much work to implement, if a dev already put that effort in they are unlikely to just walk away from all that work by disabling it.

Undo button
by PsychoAttorney » 03 February 2026, 12:16 » in Gizmos

Undo button needed urgently!
by farliaa » 03 June 2025, 06:41 » in Coffee Rush

Confirm/Undo button?
by GBanuk » 04 April 2025, 12:07 » in Pond

undo button
by rich el » 09 April 2024, 05:45 » in Super Fantasy Brawl

Add a “confirm and end turn” and “undo” button
by Tardon » 21 January 2026, 09:27 » in Castles of Mad King Ludwig

No Undo?
by asudevil » 24 June 2024, 05:49 » in Distilled

My Kingdom for an undo button...
by joebyer » 25 April 2023, 13:32 » in Polis: Fight for Hegemony

Please for the love of God add a "Confirm/Undo" button!!!
by Krispe157 » 19 December 2025, 15:34 » in Castle Combo

Please add "confirm move" or "undo" button!
by Pacemakerbug » 30 June 2022, 09:03 » in Super Fantasy Brawl

confirm or undo button?
by memeasaurusrex » 06 March 2025, 15:16 » in In The Year of the Dragon

this game needs the UNDO button
by FabrizioF » 24 November 2025, 11:25 » in Bohemians

Multi-step undo should not be beta
by stas leo » 10 December 2025, 23:27 » in Terraforming Mars

Make possible to undo settlement placement
by LordRoland » 02 December 2025, 03:30 » in Catan New Energies

"Request undo" button
by Isar » 01 December 2025, 07:48 » in Suggestions

Implement better Undo functionality
by Sebmono » 01 December 2025, 18:50 » in Beyond the Sun

Suggestion: Add an "Undo" button.
by Starwarrior1128 » 07 April 2024, 22:01 » in Chakra

The Undo works, at last!
by cosmoddd » 25 June 2025, 19:33 » in Troyes

undo
by apaksl » 05 May 2024, 14:33 » in Innovation

Add an "Undo" button
by SteelPenguinPirate » 04 December 2023, 15:30 » in Targi

Undo button when?
by LilBlueSpider » 12 July 2021, 13:50 » in Keyflower

Undo
by Devastator » 01 September 2020, 08:58 » in Downforce

Undo option for cube pick (esp. needed for touchscreens)
by Rukus McUallas » 02 September 2025, 19:15 » in Tiny Towns

Can add confirm and undo button like other game ?
by Ho yin_HK » 12 October 2025, 21:52 » in Keyflower

Add undo button?
by bregaladenting » 06 October 2025, 19:05 » in Yahtzee

This game really needs a confirm/undo feature at end of turn
by Cos- » 03 September 2023, 13:09 » in Forest Shuffle
Last edited by Meeplelowda on 12 February 2026, 23:26, edited 1 time in total.
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Tisaac
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Tisaac »

FastRacoon1 wrote: 12 February 2026, 20:24 In most other games, you have to think first and then move. Why are move takebacks allowed in Santorini? It slows down the game and creates an unfair advantage for those who abuse this option.

Moreover, this feature encourages Analysis Paralysis (AP). Instead of calculating the move in their head, players use 'undo' to test every possible outcome on the board. This ruins the flow of the game and makes matches unnecessarily long.

Removing or limiting this feature would greatly improve the competitive integrity of the game. It would force players to rely on their skills rather than trial and error. I hope BGA consider this change to make the game more professional and enjoyable for everyone.
Why would that be unfair if both players can use it exactly? Also, in competitive settings, the clock is still going down when you take your turn and undo it, so it does not create any additional time so I dont understand why you are saying i would make games unnecessarily long ?
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Meeplelowda
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Joined: 14 March 2020, 10:31

Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Meeplelowda »

Tisaac wrote: 12 February 2026, 23:25 Why would that be unfair if both players can use it exactly? Also, in competitive settings, the clock is still going down when you take your turn and undo it, so it does not create any additional time so I dont understand why you are saying i would make games unnecessarily long ?
I'm sure you have seen the many threads on this because it comes up often (for example, in the Azul sub-forum). The people who don't want undo believe they derive an advantage over their opponents by being able to visualize the board state without actually moving anything. At the very least, they claim that mental visualization is part of the game, which is basically what the OP said ("instead of calculating the move in their head"), even if they don't admit that their motivation is that they think they're better at it than other players.

As for the length of the game, you are assuming they will try every single option using mental visualization that they are trying by using undo. It is plausible that they may only think of a couple variations, then just choose one of those precisely because they don't like the process of mental visualization. Think of this example: if undo were allowed in chess, someone could make a move that they can see leaves a piece hanging and just undo it once they see it right there on the board, whereas without undo they'd be stuck with it. I certainly have had the experience of realizing a mistake the moment I take my hand off the piece (or finger off the mouse button online).
Last edited by Meeplelowda on 14 February 2026, 11:45, edited 1 time in total.
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Jellby
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Jellby »

Undo should be implemented (as much as possible) asynchronously: i.e. one should be able to do and undo at will, and only when clicking the final confirm button should the opponents see the result of the move. Then everyone would be happy.
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Meeplelowda
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Meeplelowda »

Jellby wrote: 13 February 2026, 18:55 Then everyone would be happy.
I doubt it. The issue people who want to ban undo have is not simply that they can see their opponent trying out different choices. That's my personal issue with undo. I don't care if someone uses it; I just don't want to see anything change until it's actually the next person's turn so that on my end it just looks like they spent a long time thinking about their move. But players like OP don't want someone to be able to use undo for "trial and error" at all, regardless of whether it is visible. So they will not be happy.
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Jellby
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Jellby »

Yes, I know... I considered adding "for some definition of 'everyone'" :p

Maybe they won't be happy, but they won't know if the other player is making trial moves and undoing or just thinking.

I see a more serious problem in other more complex games where a move can involve many different actions. If you see all your opponent's actions as they are made, you can process them and plan accordingly. But if you only see the final result at the end of their turn, you have to spend some extra time during your turn trying to figure out what exactly was your opponent did.
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Arjuna92
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Arjuna92 »

Jellby wrote: 14 February 2026, 09:22I see a more serious problem in other more complex games where a move can involve many different actions. If you see all your opponent's actions as they are made, you can process them and plan accordingly. But if you only see the final result at the end of their turn, you have to spend some extra time during your turn trying to figure out what exactly was your opponent did.
That's a good point. Also, when you're trying out moves you not only show what you're doing sooner but also betraying other moves you're thinking about, maybe betraying cards in your hand, etc. I certainly don't mind my opponents undoing their turns and seeing their thought process :D

I find it frustrating when there's neither undo nor confirmation and a misclick can sink your game. And in some games undo is just a necessity. I can't really fathom playing Pax Renaissance without.
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Feerzitaa
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Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Feerzitaa »

This is ridiculous. We're playing on our phones.
Very often we just click on the wrong spot.

I find disappointing when i play a game e just click where i shouldn't and cant undo my moves.

Go play live on person then.

Undo has to exist in every game.
Maybe just not show to the opponent (as someone recommended above)
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Zwejhajfa
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Joined: 19 June 2025, 09:19

Re: Disable takebacks to prevent abuse

Post by Zwejhajfa »

The most compelling argument for undo in this game is the implementation of the god powers. There are many gods that require you to press "Skip" at the right time to activate your god power, or to avoid activating it when you don't want to, and it's not always obvious what is happening or how it was implemented in the game. Additionally, some interactions of the god powers are far from intuitive if you're not a seasoned veteran.

I've had it happen plenty of times that I've made a move and then wondered what just happened before I realized that I had accidentally used my god power. With dozens of different god powers, some of which you may rarely see, undo is completely necessary to avoid the frustration of making a wrong move by accident.
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