Convoy From Europa

[Lytical]

Yes, we could write a simple if->else statement that only applies to those two effects: Card draw and paying the 6 MC.

Technically, that would be an incorrect rules implementation, but as it stands now, we have a similar but different issue - either way, sometimes the active player has to do [action A] before [action B].

But,

If Point Luna plays Nuclear Zone, for example, The "draw card" effect of Point Luna immediately is technically available. But at that point, the code doesn't yet know that a tile might be placed on the south pole. All the code knows is that Ppoint Luna has played an earth tag.

Not if you put if statement is proper place or make Point Luna confirming its earth tag draws. If if statement requires MC req. then there won't be any draws before MC requirements are met. That means until rebate from ocean came back meeting the req. nuke zone tile won't come out, and if the card is not playable on the pole, then card draw won't happen. And if the player confirming card draw first, then he is locked in not able to place nuke zone down unless rebate meets MC requirement. It's all about the if statement, just fix that. There is nothing I see that will soft lock the game, beyond just a quick fix for all by pushing card draw to the end, do that for the alpha, but roll back the code for the main push.

I swear to you, it's just a simple fix for the if statement, just do that.

P.S. we are not going to feel sorry for Pointy Luna right? If he mess up by getting a card and now he can't place on pole, that's on him/her/it, especially after a confirmation. That's just a ?? blunder on the player.

Yeah there is like ZERO reason why card draw had to be at the very end for all the interactions, I think it's just a carpet bomb fix to cover up the mistakes in the initial coding.

[Lytical]

Ok, to do list or my wishlist:

1) Fix the if statement so none shall pass the MC requirement.
2) Add Point Luna card draw confirmation for fail safe. Could affect game logic.
3) Have an option to turn off the Mars University draw confirmation, it's a nice feature but slow down the pace and do not affect game logic.

[xspuipuke]

Lytical, neither you nor Frank have seen the code of the game. Other than the dev no one is qualified to claim anything being “simple”. It might be simple for a specific card but it is not simple in general. Please read up on the Boolean satisfiability problem or the halting problem in general.

[Yahyra]

I agree with the sentiment that often what 'seems simple' in coding turns into a corner case nightmare of implementation.

In other news, I am sure anyone who wants to do unpaid, unappreciated voluntary labor can sign up to be a dev here on BGA and work on these games, including of course T Mars.

[Lytical]

Yes I understand that; if not the if statement, adding confirmation for Point Luna would do the trick 2. B/c the card draw confirmation would allow a check before soft lock. You won't able to draw if Nuke won't be able to be played. And if you draw before, then you won't able to play the nuke anyway b/c of the MC requirement.

[FrankJones]

That would mean players cannot place on the south pole without first having 6 MC, even though there is a way to have the 6 MC by the end of the action sequence. Either way, it won't be perfect.

[xspuipuke]

Yes I understand that; if not the if statement, adding confirmation for Point Luna would do the trick 2. B/c the card draw confirmation would allow a check before soft lock. You won't able to draw if Nuke won't be able to be played. And if you draw before, then you won't able to play the nuke anyway b/c of the MC requirement.

It is mathematically impossible to compute whether or not an arbitrary chain of events will fail. Unless you code every single card combo separately (which is also impossible due to the number of possible effects in the game), you won‘t be able to reliably predict the outcome.

[flashgorton]

I just think of it as a house rule.

The dev has done an amazing job programming the game in the first place. They're clearly a really competent programmer and must have solved all sorts of difficult problems along the way. So if was a simple problem, they'd already have solved it.

Or, to look at another way, it's not a problem in the code, it's a problem with the game rules for allowing for illegal states to arise.

[Lytical]

Yes I understand that; if not the if statement, adding confirmation for Point Luna would do the trick 2. B/c the card draw confirmation would allow a check before soft lock. You won't able to draw if Nuke won't be able to be played. And if you draw before, then you won't able to play the nuke anyway b/c of the MC requirement.

It is mathematically impossible to compute whether or not an arbitrary chain of events will fail. Unless you code every single card combo separately (which is also impossible due to the number of possible effects in the game), you won‘t be able to reliably predict the outcome.

When you add in Point Luna card draw confirmation, does it fail? Can you try it? Make it a hard confirmation.

[Yahyra]

Yes I understand that; if not the if statement, adding confirmation for Point Luna would do the trick 2. B/c the card draw confirmation would allow a check before soft lock. You won't able to draw if Nuke won't be able to be played. And if you draw before, then you won't able to play the nuke anyway b/c of the MC requirement.

It is mathematically impossible to compute whether or not an arbitrary chain of events will fail. Unless you code every single card combo separately (which is also impossible due to the number of possible effects in the game), you won‘t be able to reliably predict the outcome.

I even linked the wikipedia entry!