Spotted Towhee needs to join the powerful bird cards.

[zaperok0]

Strongly disagree with this. You have not played wood duck or the other powerful bird cards looks like, those were nasty. If you had them practically you had won already the game. This one though only if you have a powerful grassland you can say it's good other than that it's just meh. You need to think about different strategies not always thinking about going grassland strategy

[Yahyra]

Hi all, original poster (OP),

Where could we (or I) find and read how the banning of the powerful four birds came about? Is it on BGA only or did Steigmeier (spelling) post a suggested ban* on their official website etc. * = of course, once you have a copy of the game you can play it as you wish.

I tried using the BGA forum search to find a thread about this but I couldn't find it. Maybe it is worth 'sticky' the post that addresses this.

Note I am not providing opinions of the ban of the common raven et al (including the towhee); I am looking to understand how the ban was decided and implemented. So many games have had so many suggested bans or tweaks, I am looking to understand how this one happened. Thanks for reading and any information you can share.

[Jellby]

https://boardgamearena.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26981
https://boardgamearena.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29817

[FrankJones]

From what I recall, the option to remove the overpowered cards arose when the collective experience of high-level and analytical players illustrated how broken the cards are. Which is typically how it happens, right?

1) Players discover imbalances missed during initial playtesting.
2) Discussion ensues.
3) The decision-makers become aware of the imbalances.
4) The decision-makers decide whether to modify the game in some way to mitigate the balance issues.

I do not know how often the 4th step in that above process happens. From what I've seen, it's surprisingly common for game designers/publishers to just shrug and essentially say, "Oh well."

There have bene numerous threads about balance issues in Terraforming Mars, Race for the Galaxy, and probably lots of other very well known games.

Two other games that I know and play very well have some significant balance concerns.

And one famous game that I just started getting into - Ark Nova - seems to have some very weak and very strong cards.

In most cases, the issues likely need to be egregious for the designer/publisher to intervene and make official changes.

[Ceaseless]

From what I recall, the option to remove the overpowered cards arose when the collective experience of high-level and analytical players illustrated how broken the cards are. Which is typically how it happens, right?

1) Players discover imbalances missed during initial playtesting.
2) Discussion ensues.
3) The decision-makers become aware of the imbalances.
4) The decision-makers decide whether to modify the game in some way to mitigate the balance issues.

I do not know how often the 4th step in that above process happens. From what I've seen, it's surprisingly common for game designers/publishers to just shrug and essentially say, "Oh well."

There have bene numerous threads about balance issues in Terraforming Mars, Race for the Galaxy, and probably lots of other very well known games.

Cards games like MTG and Yugioh frequently have new banlists modifying the legal cardpool by limiting/banning cards. BGA's Wizards of the Grimoire banned Secret Oath.

And one famous game that I just started getting into - Ark Nova - seems to have some very weak and very strong cards.

Well, cards can often be grouped that way in most games, so that's a pretty tame statement.

[FrankJones]

True. Perhaps what I was trying to say was, "some frustratingly weak cards and some frustratingly strong cards", such that I wouldn't be surprised if there were discussions about nerfing or buffing some of them, or removing some of them. I'm guessing these discussions exist, given the massive popularity of the game.

At the very least, the 1-appeal compensation for going second seems inadequate.

[Groovenstein]

True. Perhaps what I was trying to say was, "some frustratingly weak cards and some frustratingly strong cards", such that I wouldn't be surprised if there were discussions about nerfing or buffing some of them, or removing some of them. I'm guessing these discussions exist, given the massive popularity of the game.

At the very least, the 1-appeal compensation for going second seems inadequate.

Fire Rescue Station into the sun

[FrankJones]

I haven't used that map yet. Is it strong or weak? I'm guessing strong, since it can add a bunch of icons to the zoo? If I'm even understanding that map's specialty correctly.

[Groovenstein]

I haven't used that map yet. Is it strong or weak? I'm guessing strong, since it can add a bunch of icons to the zoo? If I'm even understanding that map's specialty correctly.

Yeah not to get too off thread here, but you understand correctly. It’s busted.

[FrankJones]

I haven't used that map yet. Is it strong or weak? I'm guessing strong, since it can add a bunch of icons to the zoo? If I'm even understanding that map's specialty correctly.

Yeah not to get too off thread here, but you understand correctly. It’s busted.

I think getting off thread is good. I think the discussion of the spotted Towhee has been wrapped up. I mean, not much else to say about it that hasn't been said.

But, yeah, I'll shift to the Ark Nova forum if I have any further questions.