doubles in Castles of burgundy

[Ceaseless]

True. I think. I think I agree with nik592.


I hate concedes

I also had two recent opponents who did this:

Queued for fast turn based.

Made No love during the 12 hour window.

I cannot force abandon or expel.

So, I eventually forced abandoned game.

I could have taken two cheap wins. But I did not.

That said, both of these players annoyed the hell out of me. MAKE A GODDAMN MOVE.

At (presumably) 0% completion, don't think there's much be said about a cheap win when you aren't getting any rating from it. It's more about giving them a loss with an additional penalty. Players that kick others for this also ensure that a player cannot safely try to not play right at the start to sneak an abandon out of a bad opening hand.

[FrankJones]

True. I think. I think I agree with nik592.


I hate concedes

I also had two recent opponents who did this:

Queued for fast turn based.

Made No love during the 12 hour window.

I cannot force abandon or expel.

So, I eventually forced abandoned game.

I could have taken two cheap wins. But I did not.

That said, both of these players annoyed the hell out of me. MAKE A GODDAMN MOVE.

At (presumably) 0% completion, don't think there's much be said about a cheap win when you aren't getting any rating from it. It's more about giving them a loss with an additional penalty. Players that kick others for this also ensure that a player cannot safely try to not play right at the start to sneak an abandon out of a bad opening hand.

@ Ceaseless: Good point. I did not even consider that.
Is it possible both my opponents had terrible hands and were trying to induce a forced abandon from me?

After looking at the game, They both did have horrible hands.

I should just kick/expel ???

[tbhp]

Might there be a correlation between conceded and abandoned games and a deviation from expected number of doubles? Would this correlation compound the error of giving them equal weight?

Pretty much, it seems that people who play the game tend to agree that getting a lot of doubles is disadvantageous.

Even without that, it's statistically likely that the various events happening in a game will have an effect on your winrate, whether positive or negative. So, a game being conceded is not a stat-neutral occurrence. It's going to correlate with the events that give you more chances of losing.

[FrankJones]

True. I think. I think I agree with nik592.


I hate concedes

I also had two recent opponents who did this:

Queued for fast turn based.

Made No love during the 12 hour window.

I cannot force abandon or expel.

So, I eventually forced abandoned game.

I could have taken two cheap wins. But I did not.

That said, both of these players annoyed the hell out of me. MAKE A GODDAMN MOVE.

At (presumably) 0% completion, don't think there's much be said about a cheap win when you aren't getting any rating from it. It's more about giving them a loss with an additional penalty. Players that kick others for this also ensure that a player cannot safely try to not play right at the start to sneak an abandon out of a bad opening hand.

True,
By not kicking either player, I basically emboldened them to continue their annoying behavior.

[tbhp]

True. I think. I think I agree with nik592.


I hate concedes

I also had two recent opponents who did this:

Queued for fast turn based.

Made No love during the 12 hour window.

I cannot force abandon or expel.

So, I eventually forced abandoned game.

I could have taken two cheap wins. But I did not.

That said, both of these players annoyed the hell out of me. MAKE A GODDAMN MOVE.

At (presumably) 0% completion, don't think there's much be said about a cheap win when you aren't getting any rating from it. It's more about giving them a loss with an additional penalty. Players that kick others for this also ensure that a player cannot safely try to not play right at the start to sneak an abandon out of a bad opening hand.

@ Ceaseless: Good point. I did not even consider that.
Is it possible both my opponents had terrible hands and were trying to induce a forced abandon from me?

After looking at the game, They both did have horrible hands.

I should just kick/expel ???

You can always outplay them at their own game, by just leaving the game running, thus forcing them to play before the end of the tournament round/Arena season, or else they will get an automatic loss.

Although I don't agree with the expulsion, I think Ceaseless is right about one part. If someone started a game, it means they committed to finishing it, can't let them just get away with an abandon.

[Ceaseless]

True. I think. I think I agree with nik592.


I hate concedes

I also had two recent opponents who did this:

Queued for fast turn based.

Made No love during the 12 hour window.

I cannot force abandon or expel.

So, I eventually forced abandoned game.

I could have taken two cheap wins. But I did not.

That said, both of these players annoyed the hell out of me. MAKE A GODDAMN MOVE.

At (presumably) 0% completion, don't think there's much be said about a cheap win when you aren't getting any rating from it. It's more about giving them a loss with an additional penalty. Players that kick others for this also ensure that a player cannot safely try to not play right at the start to sneak an abandon out of a bad opening hand.

@ Ceaseless: Good point. I did not even consider that.
Is it possible both my opponents had terrible hands and were trying to induce a forced abandon from me?

After looking at the game, They both did have horrible hands.

I should just kick/expel ???

It's one possibility. Abandoned games don't seem to pop up in the generic game list page, but if you check that specific game they should still show up. So you can check if similar situations have popped up for them on a game-to-game basis if you check for abandoned games within a specific named game. There are other reasons, and their profile can shed some light on what possibilities seem more likely under the circumstances. You can check what you think is worth checking and send messages you think will help rule out issues or possibly solve the problem. You can do what you can to make things work, but feel free to kick players that you don't think have reasonable cause to not be playing.

[FrankJones]

In both cases, it appeared as though they didn't realize they were queued up for fast turn based with an allowable 12 hour window that started almost as soon as they signed off.

I doubt anyone would intentionally log off at 5:45 PM while queued up for a 24-move-a-day game that could have a 6 PM to 6 AM window, especially when that player seemingly doesn't intend to be on BGA until "morning" (whenever that player's morning is).

[RandomUN]

True,
By not kicking either player, I basically emboldened them to continue their annoying behavior.

By not kicking the player, they receive no penalty to their karma and the number displaying on their reputation for recent penalties won't increase. So players getting a pass like this also does a disservice to other players that rely on this information to make decisions on whether or not to even play with someone in the first place. It means the next time they do get kicked, the reputation penalty will be less than it would have been, and players that have set a minimum reputation for matching may get matched with someone more likely not to finish the game.

These systems are in place for a reason. Now, I primarily play real time, so it is more important to me that a player I am matched with is actually playing the game when it is their turn. Even then, if it is on the first turn and they haven't made a move, I do check if their reputation has a history of being expelled. If they don't, then I will choose abandon instead of kick, assuming that they have some sort of connection issue or emergency.

[tbhp]

True,
By not kicking either player, I basically emboldened them to continue their annoying behavior.

By not kicking the player, they receive no penalty to their karma and the number displaying on their reputation for recent penalties won't increase. So players getting a pass like this also does a disservice to other players that rely on this information to make decisions on whether or not to even play with someone in the first place.

It's not our fault if the only way the site provides us to penalize a player is to end our game with them. I've been suggesting for months that it should be possible to give a penalty without ending the game, but the idea doesn't seem to gain any traction even though it's such a simple, obvious solution to the problem you cite.