Only 2 minutes for the opening round?

[Jwheely]

Hey there,

So overall: I'm happy with the timers available to each speed. But as a player who hasn't yet memorized and internalized every card, I struggle with the opening timers. There's a lot to consider. Which cooperations go best with the given cards? Which Prelude cards fit this strategy? How many unplayable cards can I afford for the late game? And so forth. But the beginning timer on normal mode doesn't always accomodate that.

I feel like an extra minute would really help. Playing in slow doesn't really seem like the right solution, because I don't feel like I need more time for the entirety of the game. Solidarity from the other players would help, but yesterday I encountered another one of those players who was all to happy to press the button in the opening round as soon as he had the chance. No checking whether I was afk, obviously no stalling from my part, heck - I even announced in chat that I needed a few seconds.
Luckily I was able to make a choice. And I felt compelled to question the reasonining of the player, while explaining my situation. To which he said: "I like to uttilize the tools this platform has given me to their full extend. If you have a problem with the mechanics on BGA you should take it up with the devs". And sure, he is technically within his right, but refused to explain the morality of it all. I think these players typically seem to enjoy the strategy of Terraforming the planet ASAP (it was a 3 player game). And I've often thought me needing time is a skill issue. But in this case, I actually went to win the game with the lowest TF-rating.

So how do others feel about this particular timer? And the option to deprive yourself and others of fun the first moment that it runs out? I don't take issue with this option in general. But I feel like BGA doesn't respect the heuristics of the opening phase with the 2 minute timer. And since I'd like to continue playing the game here, I'm hoping for it to change.

[Yahyra]

Hi original poster (OP),


There are indeed ways to suggest implementations on here on BGA; I think the procedure is to go to the bugs / suggestion forum and make a thread. People have upvote (or perhaps downvote?) your thread.

My opinions are aligned to yours on this; two minutes seems a bit too fast to math our your starting resources, hand, preludes, placements, etc.

I think I saw a thread or video recently where one of the leaders of the arena season (maybe it was the person who won the whole season, or maybe it was just a Rulers of Mars Abstein tournament) where they said 'I wanted to play the game real time but I needed more time to think about my starting hand so I asked my opponent and we agreed to host the game as turn based'. etc etc. ...

[dizinovi]

If you don't know all cards, preludes and corporations by heart, you must be completely new to the game. Give it 30 more games and you will never have an issue with time again. I'm said to be the fastest player in the top100, or at least one of, and on my first game of Colonies on this site I had trouble making moves in time (I was familiar with the game, but not with the site and of Colonies I only knew additional mechanics but not cards), so it is normal that you are struggling a bit if you are new. Speaking from a high skill perspective, about 1 in 30 games might do with an additional starting time as what you get offered can go in 2 vastly different directions depending on which strategy you choose, but ultimately it's just another binary choice to make, and if you can't decide quickly it is likely they are similarly good so just pick one and lean into it. As for learning cards, you might also want to use a shortcut and watch a video(s) on them on YouTube to learn how good each card is.

[FrankJones]

If you don't know all cards, preludes and corporations by heart, you must be completely new to the game.

Anyone who does not have a 215 or 260 card deck memorized is "completely new to the game"?

Give it 30 more games and you will never have an issue with time again.

The suggestion for extra time at the start (Choosing preludes, corporation, and project cards, perhaps while taking colonies into account) has been supported by some master-level players with hundreds of games played.

Your opinions are not facts.

I'm said to be the fastest player in the top100, or at least one of, and on my first game of Colonies on this site I had trouble making moves in time (I was familiar with the game, but not with the site and of Colonies I only knew additional mechanics but not cards), so it is normal that you are struggling a bit if you are new.

So, because you can play at a lightning-fast pace, everyone else should be able to also? One of the players you are replying to has 450 games played and a 450 Elo. Another 30 games won't change that player's mind about liking the idea of some extra time for the first turn.

[dizinovi]

So, because you can play at a lightning-fast pace, everyone else should be able to also? One of the players you are replying to has 450 games played and a 450 Elo. Another 30 games won't change that player's mind about liking the idea of some extra time for the first turn.

No, I am all for longer starting times actually, but my opinion is that it is rarely needed, especially if people don't try to kick you after you asked for extra time. I mean even I agree to anything people ask for, be it time or abandoning for a reason other than dodging a loss or playing with 1 action, so I imagine most people would. And I was only replying to the original poster, and I stand by the statement that you learn all cards in 50 games(they have 20), and you understand cards in about 500 games of a repeated format (eg. Acquired Company will look bad even gen1 if you are only experiencing the game in 5p, and it will look like one of 20 best cards to start with in 2p). "Give it 30 games" is more of an encouraging fact that things will get better quick, given that they said they don't struggle with time later in the game, so clearly their only issue is being overwhelmed by 16 cards in the start, whereas 4 cards in drafts don't pose an issue. 16 knowns are easier to manage than 4 unknowns, so as soon as they learn cards it's all gonna go smoothly. And yes, I am making that statement based on a fact I know all 150 or 151 Pokemon from the first season, and only about 30 more from later seasons, because I spent a short time getting familiar with those from the first season and only brushed later cartoons and games.

[FrankJones]

So, because you can play at a lightning-fast pace, everyone else should be able to also? One of the players you are replying to has 450 games played and a 450 Elo. Another 30 games won't change that player's mind about liking the idea of some extra time for the first turn.

No, I am all for longer starting times actually, but my opinion is that it is rarely needed, especially if people don't try to kick you after you asked for extra time.

The problem is some players are not accommodating and are simply looking to expel players at every opportunity.

And, not all players are going to know the game well enough after 50 plays to be able to comfortably pick from 2 corporations, 4 preludes, and 10 project cards with the limited starting time given for that first turn. Different people's brains are wired differently.

[Paddles]

The problem is some players are not accommodating and are simply looking to expel players at every opportunity.

I think this is the nub of it. Some people seem to just want the win in their statistics, no matter how they get it (even if it's by timing out a player on the first move). Others seem to want to face the challenge of the game, and would rather lose to a better strategy (or even bad luck) than win on a technicality. Could be that some people prioritise continuous action over delays/waiting, regardless of the game outcome. Only becomes an issue when people with incompatible agendas are on the same board.

Personally, I don't like kicking people out unless it looks like they are being deliberately obnoxious (e.g. disappearing because they're losing, insulting other players). If someone wants some thinking time, I'm happy to grant it - especially on the heavier games. For something like TM, I know I need more time than many because I've only played a handful in times total, so definitely can't remember all the different cards like I would for some games I've played much more. In the absence of additional thinking time, a real-time game with turn-based clock to allow the thinking when you need it becomes the most viable option.

[Jellby]

Before disparaging those who kick, you should consider that maybe they already took suboptimal moves because they were trying to play within the time limits. Should they then grant you extra time?

[Bender3002]

They played suboptimal moves before the game started? How is that possible?

[Yahyra]

I am not the person who made the comment(s)... but I can understand that the poster of the comment seemed to mean to imply that some people who kick did abide by the BGA rules of playing within the time provided; this would all be 'as or after the starting hand' is determined etc. ...