Is a good game really a good game?

[edhildur]

Many players text "gg" at the end of a game, sometimes apparently automatically and maybe thoughtlessly, sometimes genuinely thinking that the game was a good one.

However, many games aren't good, for many reasons. If one or more players got crushed like bugs, it might have been a good game for the winner, but it wouldn't have been good for the losers (and in such cases if the winner/s text gg it can look like gloating). If the result was decided by extreme luck - whether good or bad - that isn't a good game. If one or more players played like drunken monkeys (and all too often I'm guilty of this, although I try not to), that isn't a good game either. There are of of course other things that make for a bad game, but for this post those are the key factors.

I think what makes a good game is where everyone played reasonably well, the finish was close, everyone had a chance to win, and the final result was decided mostly by good play. Sadly, such games are relatively rare. Most games are fairly ok, but only ok. Quite a few games aren't at all good, but people still text gg.

I almost never text gg. Too often it's too subjective a judgement. Instead, I much prefer simply to thank people for having played the game. I think it's always ok to say thanks. And if a really bad game is described as good, and I respond negatively, sorry. I usually try to say thanks anyway.

Oh yes, thanks for reading this post .

[Recidive]

I see it more as a mark of politeness at the end of the game. Whether or not it went well for you, you show your good sportmanship and in essence, congratulate your opponent(s) regardless of the result. You both tried your best with the cards you were dealt (figuratively). Whether a game is a win or a loss should have next to no impact on the fact that you enjoyed playing it.

[RayasRouge]

Thanks for your post Edhildur

I understand people who text "gg",
but like you I would prefer "Thanks for the game"

or just "Thx" ;o))))

[edhildur]

I see it more as a mark of politeness at the end of the game. Whether or not it went well for you, you show your good sportmanship and in essence, congratulate your opponent(s) regardless of the result. You both tried your best with the cards you were dealt (figuratively). Whether a game is a win or a loss should have next to no impact on the fact that you enjoyed playing it.

Thanks for responding.

One point I was trying to make about texting of "gg" or any abbreviated response is that it often looks automatic. Automatic responses are not really polite, they are empty. One may as well assume that everyone has texted gg and save even that minimal effort of typing the same letter twice. "Thanks", however, is always polite.

If one wants to congratulate someone for winning or playing well, one can text "congraulations" or "well played". That's one of the great things about language, we can use it to convey lots of different meanings.

And no, it's not about winning or losing as such, but that's not what I wrote. A close, well-played game - whether one wins or loses - is or should be more enjoyable for all than a game where the victory margin was huge, or where the result was decided by hugely bad luck, or by incompetence. Speaking for myself, to win by default, including when someone quits or times out, or plays badly, or has horrifically bad luck, is not really enjoyable. That said, to claim that a win or a loss should have next to no impact on enjoyment seems a little disingenuous. People play games to win, and the result makes a difference. Only robots don't care about winning or losing, but they don't get any enjoyment out of playing.

[Fysh99]

As Recidive wrote, it's just a mark of sportsmanship. I wouldn't necessarily say gg after every single game, but I am more likely to if I have lost.

If there are other interesting aspects to the game, then sometimes I strike up a conversation during play, which sometimes leads to repeat challenges, or occasionally exploring other games together. If it has been a particularly good game, I might make some further comment, but otherwise "gg" is just a decent quick response to show that you have been playing another person, and not just a game by yourself.

[Oso]

It's just for politeness, like stretching hands when a game finish like in Tennis or Chess.

[Liallan]

One point I was trying to make about texting of "gg" or any abbreviated response is that it often looks automatic. Automatic responses are not really polite, they are empty. One may as well assume that everyone has texted gg and save even that minimal effort of typing the same letter twice. "Thanks", however, is always polite.

I totally get what you're saying here. It's like when people ask how you're doing, and if you're not doing well, they really don't want to hear it. They ask because it's the polite thing to do. People "go through the motions" a lot. It can be a little fake sometimes.

At the same time, not doing something can be impolite. "gg" is easy to type and it makes it easy to just "do the polite thing" without going to a lot of trouble, etc. But, at the same time, at least (some) people do it - they get the idea that it's the polite or respectful thing to do. When people don't do it, you could say they don't care enough to say anything. (And I am guilty of having gotten out of the habit of saying something both to start and end a game.) So while it might be rather automatic, people are doing it because it's the respectful thing to do. They are at least saying they have good enough "gamesmanship" to bother.

I disagree that the winner doing it is gloating. I think it's even more important when the winner does it, to acknowledge that you were just as important to the game as a non-winner, and making a good attempt at the game. (And if you played very badly and they know it, maybe they think you did the best you could, which should count for something.) Honestly, I don't think a gloater would even bother. And if you were the winner, just say thanks in response.

If one wants to congratulate someone for winning or playing well, one can text "congraulations" or "well played". That's one of the great things about language, we can use it to convey lots of different meanings.

I agree that you can change what you say each time based on the game. And "thanks for the game" works well too, especially if your opponents lost horribly or things didn't go so great. You can still say "thanks" for playing. But keep in mind that "thanks" can be said just as automatically and without thinking as "gg" can. The words someone uses doesn't imply how sincere they are, not from just one or two words. If you say "thanks," how do they know it's not just an automatic habit on your part?

And no, it's not about winning or losing as such, but that's not what I wrote. A close, well-played game - whether one wins or loses - is or should be more enjoyable for all than a game where the victory margin was huge, or where the result was decided by hugely bad luck, or by incompetence. Speaking for myself, to win by default, including when someone quits or times out, or plays badly, or has horrifically bad luck, is not really enjoyable. That said, to claim that a win or a loss should have next to no impact on enjoyment seems a little disingenuous. People play games to win, and the result makes a difference. Only robots don't care about winning or losing, but they don't get any enjoyment out of playing.

First, no not everyone plays to win. Yes, most people would prefer to win, but some people really are playing just to be playing and aren't too concerned about it. But that said.... second, you're taking "good game" too literally. You want to take it to mean that the game itself literally was a good game. But I think it's more about the players, not the game. That is, more about the acknowledgment that you played, finished (especially if you're losing), did what for you was your best under the circumstances, etc. It's just a politeness thing, not a literal thing. (Not to mention that everyone might define "good" in different ways, which is another good reason not to take it literally.)

Also keep in mind, this is what the site teaches. Yes, people do it at all sites, I'm not saying that. But the site itself encourages being polite, saying hi to your fellow players, at the very least to say "hf & gl" at the start and "gg" at the end, just to acknowledge everyone and show some respect for them. (I think this is in the section about getting your green thumbs.) So that's what people do.

So I'd keep in mind (a) that even just a "gg" is acknowledging you and better to do so than not, and (b) don't take those words literally to mean the game itself was good.

(By the way, an interesting topic.)

[Shaq Jenkins]

I agree with this post. I was actually going to post something similar to this.

Saying "gg" at the end of a game has become a stock, emotionless response around here. People say it regardless of the context of the game. It feels insincere. I know some people are arguing that it's polite, but I don't agree. Is it polite to say "gg" to a player that you just easily beat by 100 points? It might have been a good game for you but I highly doubt your opponent feels that way. I like the idea of saying "thanks for playing" or "congratulations," etc. The ending response should fit the actual context of the game.

Players should also stop saying "gg" way before the game has ended. I was playing Seasons recently, and my opponent assumed that he was going to win the game, so he said "gg" as soon as we entered Fall Year 3. Little did he know that I had a plan in place that would help me win the game, and I ended up beating him by around 50 points. It's arrogant and dismissive to say "gg" before the game is actually over. At least let the other players have their final turns before saying it.

The culture of BGA is really interesting. Sadly, it's one of the most anti-social gaming sites I've played on. There's countless times when I've said "hi" to my opponent at the beginning of the game and the person didn't reply. There's also very little chatting that occurs during the game. It sometimes feels as if I'm playing against robots and not actual human beings. Yes, this is an online site, but remember that there's a person on the other end of the computer. This might also have to do with the language barrier, as people speak multiple different languages on this site, but "hi" is a universal greeting that anyone can understand. At the same time, I've had English speaking players refuse to return my greetings as well...

[senatorhung]

I agree with this post. I was actually going to post something similar to this.

Saying "gg" at the end of a game has become a stock, emotionless response around here. People say it regardless of the context of the game. It feels insincere. I know some people are arguing that it's polite, but I don't agree. Is it polite to say "gg" to a player that you just easily beat by 100 points? It might have been a good game for you but I highly doubt your opponent feels that way. I like the idea of saying "thanks for playing" or "congratulations," etc. The ending response should fit the actual context of the game.

Players should also stop saying "gg" way before the game has ended. I was playing Seasons recently, and my opponent assumed that he was going to win the game, so he said "gg" as soon as we entered Fall Year 3. Little did he know that I had a plan in place that would help me win the game, and I ended up beating him by around 50 points. It's arrogant and dismissive to say "gg" before the game is actually over. At least let the other players have their final turns before saying it.

The culture of BGA is really interesting. Sadly, it's one of the most anti-social gaming sites I've played on. There's countless times when I've said "hi" to my opponent at the beginning of the game and the person didn't reply. There's also very little chatting that occurs during the game. It sometimes feels as if I'm playing against robots and not actual human beings. Yes, this is an online site, but remember that there's a person on the other end of the computer. This might also have to do with the language barrier, as people speak multiple different languages on this site, but "hi" is a universal greeting that anyone can understand. At the same time, I've had English speaking players refuse to return my greetings as well...

saying gg on your final turn makes more sense for turn.based games since the chat disappears as soon as the game ends. that isn't a concern for realtime games. saying gg is not arrogant. arrogant is quitting the game on the next to last turn because your opponent says gg and that clues you in to the fact that you don't have many turns left to play.

some people find in.game chat distracting .. others blather on and on. i am in either camp depending on the game and how much thinking is required. that said, if you have a game of saboteur where no one chats .. the sabs win.

gg may be 'stock' now .. but if everyone said 'thanks for playing' ... that would become stock as well. just use the BGA translate feature to turn 'gg' into 'thanks for playing' and your issue is resolved.

[Fysh99]

Players should also stop saying "gg" way before the game has ended. I was playing Seasons recently, and my opponent assumed that he was going to win the game, so he said "gg" as soon as we entered Fall Year 3. Little did he know that I had a plan in place that would help me win the game, and I ended up beating him by around 50 points. It's arrogant and dismissive to say "gg" before the game is actually over. At least let the other players have their final turns before saying it.

Unfortunately, the way the chat seems to work on this site is that if you want to ensure your opponent sees something in chat, you have to try and say it before their final move and the game ends. I'm talking about turn-based games here - not live ones. If you want to congratulate your opponent, or say anything you want them to see, it's no good ending the game. You have to make sure they have another turn to play.

The culture of BGA is really interesting. Sadly, it's one of the most anti-social gaming sites I've played on. There's countless times when I've said "hi" to my opponent at the beginning of the game and the person didn't reply. There's also very little chatting that occurs during the game. It sometimes feels as if I'm playing against robots and not actual human beings. Yes, this is an online site, but remember that there's a person on the other end of the computer. This might also have to do with the language barrier, as people speak multiple different languages on this site, but "hi" is a universal greeting that anyone can understand. At the same time, I've had English speaking players refuse to return my greetings as well...

As for your comments about people being antisocial, I disagree. I've played several people where we have ended up chatting through the game. It doesn't happen often, but then I assume most people just login to make some moves, and generally are in a hurry. That's fine by me, because primarily I come to play the games, and finding new people to add to my friends list is a bonus, not a must.