Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

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Tzinacantli
Posts: 22
Joined: 03 May 2022, 01:20

Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by Tzinacantli »

Heya!

Today I was joined by two players in a game of Dobble that looked very suspicious to me.

I lost the game, which is certainly not suspicious itself — I typically lose 1 per 10-20 games at my current ranking — what was suspicious is how I lost it. My opponents were extremely fast...inhumanly fast, you could say. It's common that high-ranking players are faster than me, but there's still usually a few miliseconds gap between choosing the same symbols on cards. Additionally, the time between "rounds" varies. With those two players, it was either practically instant, or as if they were letting me pick something to make themselves less suspicious. My cards didn't even refresh, and they already chose another set of three in the Triplet mode.

The possibilities I saw were:
a) the two players were simply better and more experienced than me, with their skills being insane;
b) my cards refreshed with a delay in comparison to theirs, so what I perceived as suspicious activity was not that bad from their side;
c) the "players" were (using) a cheating software.

I am inclined to believe it's the last option — because there's more to that story: both players were from the same country. Coincidence? Two real-life friends, perhaps? I had to investigate. I checked their profiles. Both claimed to be from the same country and speak the same language, not the most typical one for that specific country. Both accounts' nicknames ended with random numbers or other certain symbols characteristic for multiple accounts users. Still, could be an experienced couple or best friends... But then, I saw a new table on the Dobble's main site... another player from the same country, speaking the same atypical language. I camped at the table list and saw another one, and another... all from country X (fiine, one had Romania listed, but matched the pattern), speaking the same language, and every single account I checked was created today (July 9 2022). Sure, it could be a... group of school friends who decided to try BGA? But with all the above, I decided it's unlikely.

I wanted to report the players, assuming the potentially cheating accounts would get investigated, but the 'report player' form neither has such an option, nor allows to put a description anywhere. So, I guess, all I can do is to make this post and 'red thumb' all the accounts I found.
"To me, it's not the game that is imbalanced, it's the world." (fruktansvärt, 2025)
RobertBr
Posts: 667
Joined: 08 July 2016, 15:57

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by RobertBr »

Tzinacantli wrote: 09 July 2022, 22:31 a) the two players were simply better and more experienced than me, ...
Almost certainly this. 99.9% of the time when this comes up it is this.
We know of one bot playing an abstract game on the site and the bot in question has to have its moves translated through a human so its responses are not fast at all.
You should not be reporting this because you have not gathered enough evidence to indicate any issue (its also very unclear if you are concerned with a bot, use of software, or a compact of some sort). If you did have the evidence you could email support about it. But be aware trying to call it out on the forum is frowned on (so don't give the user names).
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Tzinacantli
Posts: 22
Joined: 03 May 2022, 01:20

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by Tzinacantli »

You should not be reporting this because you have not gathered enough evidence to indicate any issue (its also very unclear if you are concerned with a bot, use of software, or a compact of some sort). If you did have the evidence you could email support about it.
With all due respect, why should gathering further evidence be on me? I think the 9-10 suspicious accounts I found that were all created on the same day, have the same country/language listed, appeared online within the same time range, with relatively analogical names, and with 3 of them already winning against (different) expert ranking people are enough to raise concerns (not saying they're *certainly* cheating... but y'know). At least one of the two I've played against were performing better than top 50 people, too. This makes me think the accounts are controlled by one player, possibly also using some kind of cheating software. I am not familiar with BGA policies, but when such a thing happens in online games I play, the correct action is to report it. Whether an action will be taken or not, is up to the developers. I don't think it's possible for me to gather further evidence, neither I want to spend time on spying other accounts.
But be aware trying to call it out on the forum is frowned on (so don't give the user names).

This is why I didn't even list the countries :)
(and while I am suspicious, it still could be just ten amazing X-speaking players from country Y that resemble "bots")
We know of one bot playing an abstract game on the site and the bot in question has to have its moves translated through a human so its responses are not fast at all.
(its also very unclear if you are concerned with a bot, use of software, or a compact of some sort).
I don't know enough to suspect what *exactly* that could be. I assume there are different types of cheating software. Out of curiosity, what game is it?

Human... I actually got a message from them. They stated having played the game for a very long time (which, in fact, was more than years passed since the game release until now, but that could simply be them rounding up to 15), so they could *really* be that good due to experience and skills, but that doesn't explain multiple accounts (which also played against each other).

Anyway, I am going to live it here and move on, as I've done my deed. ;)
"To me, it's not the game that is imbalanced, it's the world." (fruktansvärt, 2025)
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rquetzal
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Joined: 06 March 2020, 02:00

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by rquetzal »

Why would anyone use a bot on this site anyway? It's not like there are financial incentives to boost your ELO in a particular game.
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RicardoRix
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Joined: 29 April 2012, 23:43

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by RicardoRix »

I guess there are psychological reasons for cheating. Players try to cheat and in various ways to exploit winning ELO/Arena/Tournaments.

Are you trying to say that you've never had someone trying to steal 500's while playing monopoly?
Or have you just never noticed it?
Last edited by RicardoRix on 09 October 2022, 23:06, edited 1 time in total.
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Tzinacantli
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Joined: 03 May 2022, 01:20

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by Tzinacantli »

rquetzal wrote: 11 July 2022, 17:02 Why would anyone use a bot on this site anyway? It's not like there are financial incentives to boost your ELO in a particular game.
Some people like winning or being on top... or seeing their code work, perhaps?

(that said, I quoted you almost exclusively to tell you I like your name! :D )
"To me, it's not the game that is imbalanced, it's the world." (fruktansvärt, 2025)
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rquetzal
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Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by rquetzal »

:D ty!
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ViolentSilence
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Joined: 30 May 2015, 21:33

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by ViolentSilence »

rquetzal wrote: 11 July 2022, 17:02 Why would anyone use a bot on this site anyway? It's not like there are financial incentives to boost your ELO in a particular game.
If you go digging through the forums you'll see lots of posts of people trying to boost their ELOs for absurd reasons. I remember one person who created multiple accounts because they wanted have all the entries on the top 10 for a game. Hanabi in particular has a number of complaints about people trying to quit if they won't get a perfect score
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aghagh
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Joined: 22 November 2014, 20:38

Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by aghagh »

Today we had an experience with what looked like a bot in a "Just One" game, which is a coop.

This player systematically gave the same clue every turn ("lotteryticket") and invalidated everyone else's clues when judge (we played with the work-around of putting our valid clues in the chat when that happened).

The account was created in September 2022 and already had a very low reputation for abandoning many games.

Games mostly played by this player seem suited for a bot (Connect 4, Gomoku).

We all gave this player a red thumb at the end of the game and tried to report it for being a bot, but none of the questions in the BGA questionnaire seemed to fit this scenario.

So, in this case, I don't think it's a bot for cheating / winning / getting a lot of elo, but rather a programming challenge someone has put on themselves to troll a game.
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Meeplelowda
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Re: Suspected cheating (botting?) and seemingly no way to report it

Post by Meeplelowda »

rquetzal wrote: 11 July 2022, 17:02 Why would anyone use a bot on this site anyway? It's not like there are financial incentives to boost your ELO in a particular game.
Some people have mental health issues that cause them to want to 1) appear to others to be better at something than they are, 2) impress people with their ability to code the bot, or 3) further some other miscellaneous motivation having nothing to due with financial gain, regardless of whether (and sometimes because) it frustrates and annoys others, and they have inadequate access to support services to help them deal with the underlying issues making them behave that way.

I mean, there is a player on here that cannot be named, even by an abbreviation that isn't their actual username, who joins literally 100 tournaments just for the purpose of sitting them out and ruining the experience of others in the tournament. Explain that in terms of financial motivation.
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