How to get better in a new game?

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koningco
Posts: 98
Joined: 24 May 2024, 01:49

How to get better in a new game?

Post by koningco »

I recently started playing the card game L.L.A.M.A. and there is absolutely nothing about game strategies on the forum of that game. Also the strategy tips on the game panel are very brief: just 1 tip for early play and one for later in the round. But I would like to learn to make better decisions for example about to step out of a round and when to take another card.

But this actually is not a question about the game L.L.A.M.A. I would like to know how other players improve their play when they start with a new game on BGA. In a different card game I have seen a player who explained games by adding comments afterwards and adding the game links to his profile, but that is the only player I saw doing this while I am almost a year on BGA now. And I probably was lucky that I found that player and learnt from his explanations. I also watched back a L.L.A.M.A. game from a high ranked player, but without comments I didn't understand why he/she made different choices then I would have done. I was wondering: are there more users who make reviews with comments this and if yes: how can I find those players? And how do you guys improve your play in a game that's new for you besides playing a lot and reading the forum (if there are any useful tips and tricks posted there?
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BananaHarambe
Posts: 297
Joined: 19 June 2024, 17:40

Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by BananaHarambe »

Hi, I got #1 at Vale of Eternity through careful practice and study. Always reviewing games and looking to get better so I can provide a decent method. One thing that took me from being one of the best, to #1 player was quite likely the fact that I created a strategy wiki site for the game and wrote over 10000 words of strategy articles for the game. By actively thinking about the game enough to write it out and setting up the game info pages I was able to memorize all the cards and really think hard about card interactions. This is not a recommendation to you, but an example about how regularly thinking about the game can make you play quite a bit better.

First off, becoming very good at board games will be much easier for certain personality types and professions. Expect the top players in many games to be highly analytical, logical, strong at mental calculations with professions in STEM, computer science, or data analysis, or finance. These type of players often fall into the "good at games" type of player who can learn a game very quickly and immediately starts the game for optimal plays and patterns, good efficiency, value of relative resources, resource management all upon learning the game. They can often outplay and win against their more casual friends that have played a game over a dozen times on their second playthrough, sometimes even first. Everyone has a different starting point and expect the top players to have already started relatively high relative to their game count. Some players start a lot lower, no judgement.

What to do:

1) Play regularly, but don't grind out games endlessly. Take your time with each game and really focus on what's happening in the game. Go back and look at the game review and look for key decisions. Maybe watch from opponent's perspective to see hidden cards. Number of games and amount of practice doesn't matter. The QUALITY of practice matters a lot more. If number of games was all the mattered there wouldn't be 100-199 Elo players with over 1000 games played, but there is.

2) Find good players, play them, chat with them, befriend them. Figure out how and where the good players are playing and try to join them. This could be arena or tournaments, real-time or turn based. Good players are usually friendly and helpful so just try reaching out. Sometimes you can just message them directly to play a game or ask a simple strategy question. I did this very early on when leaning Vale of Eternity and it worked well. Now I have a bunch of strong players as friends and we all play in tournaments regularly.

Even better than online friends is having strong gamer friends in real life to play the game with and discuss strategy. I played at most 20 games IRL with a strong gaming friend before joining BGA and we learned to play the game pretty good on our own and would discuss specific cards and strategies often. When I joined BGA I immediately jumped to over 300 Elo because I already understood the game quite well. From there I would try and befriend 400+ Elo players on BGA to chat about cards and play games. I even organized tournaments and invited all the top players from leaderboards to get some good competition. If you perform well in tournaments you get rewarded with more games against better players!

3) Study all the game pieces, know all the rule interactions and little details. This means knowing the contents of any decks, tiles etc. Level of detail required required may vary. For example in Faraway, I know the relative distribution of the 4 resources in the deck, but don't know all ~100 cards exactly. In Vale of Eternity I know all 70/70 cards from memory perfectly so I can literally "look at the deck" in my head, swipe through them 1 by 1.

Also know all rule interactions so you avoid making preventable mistakes. No need to learn from experience if you can learn it from study.

4) really focus on learning strategy and tactics. The basics for most games should be easy to figure out by seeing what works and doesn't. You need to always be taking mental notes on how good a current scenario is and then what the game will likely look like later on. Can you identify strong early game setups and make them yourself?

5) Once you are good enough to focus on yourself and play well for yourself, the next step is to consider playing from your opponent's perspective, what they want to do and consider efficient ways to block them or slow them down that provide a net benefit to you. Try to really get in their hand and think about what they want to do on their turn. In Vale of Eternity I can do this very well. The game has open drafting so I keep notes of everyone's hand and know what all the cards do so I often have perfect information about their game state and put myself into their perspective about what they want. If I identify that they are looking for specific cards, or have an imbalance in their resources (currency, cards, space on board, or point scoring) I will often be able to cut them off from whatever resource they need the most, punishing them for getting imbalanced. So I might either cut them off of scoring cards to make their currency useless or I will cut them off of currency so they can't summon their cards to score, depending on the scenario. I can play from their perspective because playing for myself is easy enough now.

6) plan multiple moves in advance whenever possible. How to do this varies from game to game.

7) look at other strategy resources such as through google search, reddit, or Board Game Geek to see what they say. If you really get nothing, create a new post asking for basic strategy somewhere BGA or Reddit and see what happens.


I wouldn't look for game replays on BGA with enough comments and strategy to guide you. That's going to be very rare. Just play a game against a good player and have you 2 talk a bunch during the game. Much more straightforward.
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koningco
Posts: 98
Joined: 24 May 2024, 01:49

Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by koningco »

Thank you for your inspirational post! In general I think my personality does suit for playing games at a decent level, let's say at least 200 Elo and in games that suit me 300+ Elo. By opening this topic I already showed that I am eager to learn and get better and better in the games I play. But I also often play for the win and risk a second place to win, which is my choice and I accept that my risk-taking is a disadvantage for the Elo-rating. I played some Arena games for the game L.L.A.M.A. and you are right that this is a good way to play against better opponents. I already played against Elite players and moved up to the Gold division within 24 hours. I am going to apply some of your advices to other games as well soon!

The reason I spoke about watching game reviews is that this method worked very well for me when I improved my Poker skills by reading other people's game reviews and watching (back) sessions where someone else explained how they played. The example was from Wreckage, everyone can watch back his comment's on SwaggySr's game by selecting the comments and by watching this game back from SwaggySr's perspective: https://boardgamearena.com/gamereview?table=291436758

If there are other people who do something like this (including video's) please let me know! So far most video's I found only explain the rules of a game and/or give an opinion about games, but I haven't found video's explaining strategic decisions in board/card games. Any other advice about how to improve skills in a game is of course welcome in this topic too!
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BananaHarambe
Posts: 297
Joined: 19 June 2024, 17:40

Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by BananaHarambe »

koningco wrote: 29 March 2025, 20:42 Thank you for your inspirational post! In general I think my personality does suit for playing games at a decent level, let's say at least 200 Elo and in games that suit me 300+ Elo. By opening this topic I already showed that I am eager to learn and get better and better in the games I play. But I also often play for the win and risk a second place to win, which is my choice and I accept that my risk-taking is a disadvantage for the Elo-rating. I played some Arena games for the game L.L.A.M.A. and you are right that this is a good way to play against better opponents. I already played against Elite players and moved up to the Gold division within 24 hours. I am going to apply some of your advices to other games as well soon!

The reason I spoke about watching game reviews is that this method worked very well for me when I improved my Poker skills by reading other people's game reviews and watching (back) sessions where someone else explained how they played. The example was from Wreckage, everyone can watch back his comment's on SwaggySr's game by selecting the comments and by watching this game back from SwaggySr's perspective: https://boardgamearena.com/gamereview?table=291436758

If there are other people who do something like this (including video's) please let me know! So far most video's I found only explain the rules of a game and/or give an opinion about games, but I haven't found video's explaining strategic decisions in board/card games. Any other advice about how to improve skills in a game is of course welcome in this topic too!
If you are playing a game that’s popular enough to have an EXPERT player create online strategy content, consider yourself lucky :) . That content should be a good resource. Try to confirm that the player is actually an expert. I have heard that some games have players creating guides when they are experienced, but very average at the game. Experts will find many points in true it guides incorrect or misleading.

My suggestions were pretty general, but there are some more specific skills that are required for different game categories. LLAMA seems to be a suits and numbers, playing cards until you run out type of game, which is a common type of game. I played Odin on a different account which seems similar but it wouldn’t click for me. I’ve had a bit better luck with Mythicals, but still not my strong suit.

Specific skills are to know for this game type are the card counts in the deck and keep track of the cards consumed versus remaining, AKA card counting. This applies to many games and should also apply to LLAMA, sorry if I’m wrong. Counting cards can help you make better decisions because you will know what’s remaining and can often get a good read on what’s in the opponent’s hand later in the game if the deck gets low. Card counting can still be effective when used partially instead of perfectly if you can’t be bothered to track perfectly.

There should also be some general guidelines on how to play the game well based on what’s good to do at each stage of the game. For games with making pairs/trips and runs like Majong for example the numbers at the top and bottom of the sequence are much less valuable to keep than the others so there are simple heuristics to follow when choosing what to discard, one of which would be that on their own, outside numbers are worse than inside. Figure out all the common sense heuristics for LLAMA if you haven’t already so you can practice applying them.


Vale of Eternity is a totally different game where card evaluation is a critical skill that many players lack due to inexperience with the game/all cards in the deck. There are 70 cards in the deck and all unique, not just unique like some games but REALLY UNIQUE overall. From experience it’s possible to have a baseline rating for each card in the beginning or ending stage of the game and come up with a system to adjust each card rating based on the current game state. This would be considering preferred game flow (generally playing money maker first, then points generators middle, and point bombs late), cards you have versus what opponents have (mostly to evaluate how good each card is to them), what cards are gone/discarded, and what cards are remaining in the deck to potentially draw. There’s also each players resource and points count which are also relevant quite often.

Considering all the factors for all 4/6 cards in lineup for all 2/3 players is doable with experience but quite difficult overall l, hence the game is quite skill intensive. The method of having baseline values with plus/minus adjustments based on synergy/clashing or missing combo cards versus available cards works quite well. I can often narrow down a difficult card choice by realizing 1-2 key combo cards for one card are already unavailable for me versus the other card which still has combo cards remaining in the deck, making it likely to end up good later, but is also a threat if anyone else takes.

Figure out a system that works for you that makes sense for the game!
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Meeplelowda
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Joined: 14 March 2020, 10:31

Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by Meeplelowda »

koningco wrote: 29 March 2025, 20:42In general I think my personality does suit for playing games at a decent level, let's say at least 200 Elo and in games that suit me 300+ Elo.
Don't forget that a game like L.L.A.M.A. is very luck-dependent, as evidenced by the fact that the there is only one person with an ELO in the 400s for the game, and that's the only person over 400. Note that the more a high amount of luck determines the outcome of a game due to randomness, the fewer very high ELOs you will see among active players. The more skill can overcome randomness in the game, the higher the peak ELOs are in a game. For example, the current peak rating among active Can't Stop players is 476. No one over 500! Luck clearly is a very big factor. By this measure, L.L.A.M.A. is even more luck dependent than Can't Stop.

The current peak rating among active Carcassonne players is 826, with several over 700. There are also 6 players over 900 ELO in Azul (and 3 over 1000), indicating that skill clearly dominates the outcome despite the randomness. Ticket to Ride: Peak 833, and several over 700. Can't Stop, Carcassonne, Azul, and TTR all have huge player bases, so this isn't simply a sampling error.

Moving to a pure strategy game with no randomness at all, Hive peaks at 1092.

This is all to say that there only so good you can get at a game when the skill edge does not dominate the randomness in the game. The reason the ELOs peak at lower levels is that even if you are making the ideal decision in every situation, randomness can result in a loss to lower rated players and the losses keep the ELO capped. In contrast, in a pure abstract game with no randomness, a high ELO player will for all intents and purpose always crush a low ELO player (with an established rating, i.e., K-factor 20). I said in another thread, Magnus Carlsen should beat me 10 times out of 10 unless he's literally in a coma, and even then I don't like my odds.
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h_illes
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Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by h_illes »

In general, it's about pattern recognition. You have to identify plays that affect winning chances. The specifics of the plays depend on the game type and even on the specific game. A few game types I am familiar with:
- in engine building/racing games (e.g. Splendor, Century: Spice Road), where you have to build an engine (usually with some resource management) and then get to some finish line fast, you have to identify how to make a fast/efficient engine, and also estimate the tempo advantage versus engine efficiency to see who will get to the finish line sooner. If there is some interaction in the engine building phase, the best players will also disrupt the opponents' engine building efforts simultaneously to building their own.
- in tableaux building games (e.g. Azul and its varieties), you have to build your own structure while hindering your opponents' progress. If the game is about collecting the most points, each play translates to +/- points for you and your opponents, which allows you to do local optimization. That should get you to a decent level; the further you can calculate the optimization, the better. The best players might be able to optimize right up to the end of the game.

Also, in games where there are a lot of different factors to track which affect the final result, just staying concentrated and always considering all the factors will get you ahead of many players.
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Wreckage
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Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by Wreckage »

Hey koningco, I’ve had quite a few people tell me these ‘tutorials’ were helpful over the last few years. Even a lot of strong and expert players have said they learned from them. So it makes me feel they were worth making. They are a bit of work to make.

Some other games have strategy guides, which are helpful. This guy, Romain672 https://boardgamearena.com/forum/member ... e&u=442049, does a lot of work making helpful documents about strategy for a number of games. Let him know if his stuff is helpful. And ask him about a game if it’s not listed, he may know where to look.

There are very few walkthroughs though, where an expert explains the thought process as situations arise. I think this is an interesting way to share ideas, and maybe a better way to give insights than just reading a strategy guide.
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Shobu
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Re: How to get better in a new game?

Post by Shobu »

koningco wrote: 28 March 2025, 18:59 I recently started playing the card game L.L.A.M.A. and there is absolutely nothing about game strategies on the forum of that game.
Better check boardgamegeek forum (with some notable exceptions, like For Sale)
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