Cards Tierlist for 2 players (with 2 expansions)

[MrGuissey]

Hello everyone !

Me and my friend g4tsy have been playing Forest Shuffle for a few hundred games now in theses settings :
- 2 players only (has huge impact on the tierlist)
- with 2 expansions (alpine and woodland edge)

We decided to debate on an ultimate cards tierlist live on youtube.

Here is the tierlist for TREES only (as they are a special category) :
https://tiermaker.com/list/board-games/ ... 33/5682646

Here is another tierlist for COLORS of cards :
https://tiermaker.com/list/board-games/ ... 33/5680627

Finally, the ultimate tierlist with ALL cards :
https://tiermaker.com/list/board-games/ ... 33/5682650

Disclaimer 1 : Mushrooms are very complicated to rank, as they are the only opener which can mean an almost certain win, wherehas they might be useless later on in the game (only top card useful). How to rank a card which can either be almost an insta-win when opened or practically useless like a coinflip ? Therefore, we decided to rank them on the assumption of "having them in opening hand".

Disclaimer 2 : This was made for fun with a friend and we don't claim to have the perfect tierlist or absolute truth, so don't take it too seriously . Feel free to share your arguments towards or against the ranking ! We explain our choices in the youtube live but in french, so if people are interested I might share the replay link

Thanks to everyone !
PS : this is my first post on this forum, I was not able to put image in-message so I just added links sorry

[Miswsecond]

Hi, congratulations, it's great work, very interesting. And I agree with almost all of your choices.
Here are a few comments in my humble opinion, and I'm open to any debate !!!

I'm still surprised not to see the otters in the S rank. In my opinion, it's a very powerful scoring card (maybe even the best) that doesn't depend on luck in the draw and is strong even if you only have one. (25 points easy to get).

On the contrary, I would have put the chamois (at least the gray and pink ones) one notch lower, even though they have an excellent cost/scoring ratio. They are a little more situational and require a high number of mountain cards, which lose a little power with the addition of the second expansion because there are more cards.

And to conclude, regardless of the ranking, what is important to progress in the game is the synergy between the cards, which is why it is difficult to rank them. For example, with two expansions, the meta is clearly butterflies (as we can clearly see in your ranking), but they can easily be counterproductive if you don't quickly get the development cards (Penny Bun/Black Thorn/Stinging Nettle or even Gentian). Similarly, you have to observe your opponent. For example, if they play a chanterelle or several mushrooms from the start, the pace of the game will be faster, and you need to adapt by playing cards that don't require a big card engine, favoring amphibians, birds, or wild boars instead of butterflies.

[DJModulo]

Very interesting list indeed, thanks for sharing!
I'd like to throw in my two cents as well.

I do agree with Miswsecond that the Beech Martens should be S and the Chamois (at least the purple one) should be A. The former are massive points for minimal cost; the latter are a bit situational despite being in 'good' colours.

My other two points of discussion are a bit more general and affect more cards as a result.
a) I personally don't see Bushes as Trees and find them more comparable to Mushrooms. They don't trigger tree synergy cards in general and while they do offer space, you'd much rather occupy other spaces within your forest for your Beech Martens, Wood Ants, Penny Bun and Parasol Mushroom to work (Nightingale and Polecat notwithstanding). Their main role is to draw you cards over time. which is the same as the shrooms.

b) I seem to be quite a bit lower on plants, especially on going deep with them, which leads me to value Elderberry, Capercaillie and Bee Swarm quite a bit lower than you do (Alpine Marmot and Digitalis to a lesser extent). While I usually end up with a few plants in my forest, I wouldn't generally assume to play 3 plants over the course of the game (at which point the Elderberry starts being good) as they compete with other bottom cards quite heavily and aside from the top-tier plants are a bit situational.

I'm definitely open to debate as well, knowing that a card's value can change drastically depending on what's going on within the game (there definitely have been games where I left or placed butterflies in the clearing in favor of Hares and Foxes...)

[Carhou]

As another freak, I go in::

I generally agree. But also, I don't see how Chamois are better that Martens.

For me Parasol Mushrooms, if not as good as the Broken Mushrooms, is very good, I would say an S.

And wow, then there's a lot of disorder, that I already feel tired to continue explaining . Maybe some day I do my own Tierlist or something

Now I see the TierMakers:

https://tiermaker.com/create/forest-shu ... s-18449333
https://tiermaker.com/create/forest-shu ... e-18584212

And I saw the credit for the post in BoardGameGeek that I've initated (I'm also zasvou), and others continued. Nice! Have forgotten that
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/3208878/card-list

So, maybe if lot's of us do it, we could arrive to a vig community TierList. And could be curious. Even if some could misplace them and misrate the cards.

Anyway, nice initiative!!