Catan Karma penalties problem

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bossonic
Posts: 4
Joined: 04 February 2026, 00:13

Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by bossonic »

Hi
I am a new player and i think it is a good thing to have Karma penalties
I just think that in Catan they are in some cases not fair at all
We all want to have a good time and that's why Karma is in place
But Catan is that kind of game where you can get stuck after 5 turns with 2 villages and nowhere to go. With no concede button or an auto pass button or a resign without penalty buton
Please explain to me how it can be fair, or fun, that for the next 20 minutes of your life the only thing you have to do is press roll dice so you don't get a Karma penalty
I am sure that there is a simple solution to make everyone happy
Anyway bigger problems in life hey :) gg
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Ingoschi
Posts: 48
Joined: 17 March 2025, 22:02

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by Ingoschi »

What would you do when that happens at a real board game?
Would you ask the other players to restart the game?
And if they want to play the game to the end, would you just leave?
bossonic
Posts: 4
Joined: 04 February 2026, 00:13

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by bossonic »

It is a bit different:
1) it would be with friends and you can have a chat while you roll dices waiting for the end
2) when I play with real people I woud be the first one up to restart a game if a friend is not having fun (obviously not in the internet....) and/or in a really boring position
3) I don't see a problem with a player stopping, admitting defeat and go and have a beer waiting for next game or whatever. Play can continue with 2 or 3 players without any problem if the palyer that quits is a non factor in the game. I mean you could keep playing just to keep robbing the player that blocked you but that's even worse Karma in my opinion :)
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Jellby
Posts: 3546
Joined: 31 December 2013, 12:22

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by Jellby »

If you don't like the rules of Catan, don't play Catan. And the rules of Catan don't include quitting a game in progress.
bossonic
Posts: 4
Joined: 04 February 2026, 00:13

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by bossonic »

That's a god idea

I tell you what
When the game for me is going to be a total waste of time I will just quit and take my Karma penalty with dignity

I will feel very sorry for the people that will get only 20% of the ELo points though. Just because there isn't a concede button

All that will be within the rules. Happy?
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euklid314
Posts: 679
Joined: 06 April 2020, 22:56

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by euklid314 »

*) If you request a concede button for multiplayer games that immediately stops the game and declares the other players as winners then you actually request the current implementation.

Since there is - in general - no way to know the outcome of the game if you stop it inbetween you cannot rank the other players - thus the best solution is to tie them to each other and give them a win over you. Since you ended the game prematurely, others should be warned that you might do it again. Thus you should receive a Karma penalty.

*) If you request a concede button that does not stop the game and lets the other players continue (and lets the quitting player make null-moves) then you require quite some programming work by BGA and by its volunteers.

First of all, at the moment (almost?) all multiplayer games on BGA are treated equal - no conceding possible. At your request, some of these games would continue and BGA has to change the general site rules how to rank these games (ELO, win rate,...). Other games have no neutral "null moves" that an absent player could take according to the game rules (e.g. Agricola). These games, which are many, have to be treated separately because they cannot continue after one player leaves.

And even with Catan you have to change the programming when a player concedes.
-) You want him to roll the dice and do nothing. But you do not want the other players to have to wait, thus you have to newly program the clock.
-) If a 7 is rolled the active player has to move the robber. A null move is not allowed by the rules. If the active player is absent and any decision is made by BGA the game rules are not followed anymore. If the robber is put on the desert this is illegal since the game decided it, not the player itself. And what do you do if the robber is currently standing on the desert and all hexes have settlements beside them? Have a democratic vote among the remaining players where to place the robber?
-) In case of a 7 the absent player may have to discard half of his hand cards. The choice has an effect on the remaining players because they may rob later. So who makes the decision what cards the absent player is discarding? There is no fair algorithm (random, oldest cards, newest cards, most valuable cards,...) for that procedure.

All in all, Catan allows to replace an absent player by some minor tweaks of the rules. But since BGA is not allowed to implement house rules without consent of the game publisher BGA is not allowed to do so. And in general, game authors do not write their rules including the case that a player is leaving the game prematurely. Over the board at home you might come up with house rules. This is not possible at BGA.

I hope I gave you some insights why currently there is no conceding at multiplayer games. There might be better solutions but you did not suggest a better algorithm that handles the problems I have stated above.
Gulchen
Posts: 220
Joined: 01 October 2017, 06:55

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by Gulchen »

"If the robber is put on the desert this is illegal since the game decided it, not the player itself."

I have arguments regarding the above quote, but the main obstacle for Catan is that
the other players might have settled adjacent to the desert: ​ One would have to make
non-obvious choices when coming up with a rule for where the robber goes in such cases.


Does prioritize low-frequency numbers, or prioritize how hard it would be for the
other two players to get a settlement there? ​ If one accounts for the latter at all, then:

There is at least one difficulty involved for each other player. ​ Does one take the lowest such difficulty,
or the sum of such difficulties, or something else? ​ Does one account for how many different routes
the players could take to get there? ​ Does one account for how many resource cards the players have?
bossonic
Posts: 4
Joined: 04 February 2026, 00:13

Re: Catan Karma penalties problem

Post by bossonic »

Thanks for explaining the technical difficulties
That's much clearer now to understand why it is difficult to put a quit button

Maybe an "autopass" button would be possible? The robber would be the only issue
I honestly found myself in games where passing was the only thing I could do. And to do that for about 20 minutes just to avoid a penalty I still find it absurd and rather annoying

Anyway it's a great website and I am sure it can work well even without my suggestions as it did before

I just find the karma being a bit too severe sometimes and based on the assumption that the online world is full of people with bad intentions
That can't be true, can it? ;)

Peace
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