Table Host Custom and other question

[GTSchemer]

Sorry I am just more confused after reading all that.

In other games like Agricola it's no problem at all to host a Friendly Mode real time game. I do that sometimes when I wanna play with silly settigns that make the game very luck based. I am not the only one. There is of course no ELO for Friendly Mode and there shouldn't be any.

I may be confused, so I apologize if this is a silly question: How can you identify that it is a real-time Friendly Mode game in Agricola? Friendly Mode disables timers, as far as I am aware, so there is no way to identify whether it is real-time or turn-based.

In TI4, you can play turn-based Friendly Mode, which works as you describe, but players can play as slow or fast as they wish (no timer).


The problem that was seen in TI4 was that you could accidentally create a table which says no time limit, and appears to be Friendly Mode with no timer, yet the server silently deletes it after 4 hours of inactivity (because it's "real-time"). This can annoy players who wanted to continue the game the next day. This is somewhat common with TI4 since not everyone may have time to finish a 6-hour game in one sitting. This is a limitation of the site, as far as I am aware. The latest data I have heard is that you cannot create such a "real-time" no time limit friendly mode table using the game page lobby to create a table (clicking the infinite loop icon), per this bug report: https://boardgamearena.com/bug?id=2911

However, I believe the 4-hour deletion issue still exists if you use the Play Now lobby and accidentally make a Friendly Mode table that is real-time behind the scenes.

[EuroGamez]

The big difference it that the game appreal in the "real-time" lobby and not the "turn based" lobby. So it will be found by players looking to play a live game (but without the stress of a timer and competition). This is how I (and probably most other players) find games to join.

If I have to set it to turnbased it will be viewed by people who want to play async and have completely different expectations. Async without a timer makes no sense to me as that game could go on forever. In a live game if a player suddenly stops playing at least you'll know and players can then choose to quit. Or that player might quit and everyone can decide to play on.

here is an example from Agricola https://imgur.com/a/WZogXoP

compare that to an async friendly game with estimated time of 12 days: https://imgur.com/8wBjh1S

I would certainly be more inclined to play more games in a caasual enviroment and try different less good factions under such circumstances.

I should hope that a better solution to people getting booted from accidentaly makiing the wrong game is them learning from their mistakes (there are huge warnings everywhere) rather than take away an option for lot's of players who now instead can't create and find people to play casual games with.


And here is what "Friendly mode" looks like for TI4 with the only option possible. I only use the manual table finding and it will not appead in those tables if I create it under those contraints: https://imgur.com/y1C7ykq

[GTSchemer]

The big difference it that the game appreal in the "real-time" lobby and not the "turn based" lobby. So it will be found by players looking to play a live game (but without the stress of a timer and competition). This is how I (and probably most other players) find games to join.

If I have to set it to turnbased it will be viewed by people who want to play async and have completely different expectations. Async without a timer makes no sense to me as that game could go on forever. In a live game if a player suddenly stops playing at least you'll know and players can then choose to quit. Or that player might quit and everyone can decide to play on.

here is an example from Agricola https://imgur.com/a/WZogXoP

Did you create the lobby from the game page? As far as I am aware, the game page is the official supported way of creating tables.

I tried using the game page to create a friendly game: https://snipboard.io/GvIrih.jpg

It does seem to show up with the real time green icon in my games list: https://snipboard.io/vZcjQl.jpg

However, the game speed says "No time limit": https://snipboard.io/uYiLFU.jpg


If someone is in a game of Twilight Imperium, and says "Let's finish this tomorrow.", and the BGA interface says "No time limit", would you expect the game to be deleted after 4 hours? Would it be fair to those players who invested hours if their game was deleted like that despite saying "No time limit"?

[Icosaedro85]

I believe that having a friendly mode option for real-time matches could increase the likelihood of seeing factions other than the usual top performers—and also help generate more playtesting data for those factions.

[EuroGamez]

I've edited my post, so I am not sure you read it before all the info came up.

But I am not able to do what you said would work.

I only get this error:
Unexpected error: Real-time friendly mode not supported. Please go to Play Now and choose Turn-Based before making a table.

Also I use the manual pairing as that allowes me to created tables for multiple games I might want to play and keep track of them in a single window next to each other. I am really not a fan of the new game page table cration. I find it unintuative and complicated. I would of course use it if it was the only option. But right now it will not work for me at all.

And I would probabaly not expect the game to be there the days after, especially given the numerous warnings and big red bold popups warning be specifically about it everytime I play. Also there is the option to turn the game turn-based in the options.

Here is a screeshoot of what it looks like when I open tables for games: https://imgur.com/a/B0oQig7

[GTSchemer]

I've edited my post, so I am not sure you read it before all the info came up.

But I am not able to do what you said would work.

I only get this error:
Unexpected error: Real-time friendly mode not supported. Please go to Play Now and choose Turn-Based before making a table.

I am referring to other games than TI4, which allow this option.

And I would probabaly not expect the game to be there the days after, especially given the numerous warnings and big red bold popups warning be specifically about it everytime I play. Also there is the option to turn the game turn-based in the options.

I believe TI4 is the only game which gives you a warning about this. Other games allow you to create a real-time friendly table, and it will be deleted silently after 4 hours despite saying "No time limit".

Since TI4 is uniquely long and has a good chance of being continued the next day, it was considered important to prevent players losing their 6-hours session progress.

[EuroGamez]

OKay, I misunderstood, I thought you said it was possible with TI4 using the game page.

You probabaly have the data so I can only guess at this. But out of the many games played I think the proportion of frinedly games that are played live and then the player decide to take a break of 4+ hours are probabaly very few. And it seems an odd reason to me that in order to keep these players happy despite making a mistake and missing all the very clear information.

I don't mind the warnings, and did read them. I think it's a fine solution and any player should only really make that mistake once, there are many many other mistakes players can make within the game too that would ruin their experience. You can't protect players from everything.

The decision is to not let a whole other group of players not have the option to find people to play with. Right now the only way to even find people to play a "live" but actually turned based-game, friendly mode. Means you would probabaly have to know each of the players who join your game. Since players looking for games in the turn-based lobby are most definitely not going to there looking to play a live game.

Since it is avialable for every other game I know and play I don't see why it can't be for TI4 where it would be very well suited as the game is kindo hard to play "competetively" anyway with the sheer about of randomness, inbalances etc. A friendly and relaxed way to play the game would make many games more enjoyable.

[GTSchemer]

OKay, I misunderstood, I thought you said it was possible with TI4 using the game page.

You probabaly have the data so I can only guess at this. But out of the many games played I think the proportion of frinedly games that are played live and then the player decide to take a break of 4+ hours are probabaly very few. And it seems an odd reason to me that in order to keep these players happy despite making a mistake and missing all the very clear information.

I don't mind the warnings, and did read them. I think it's a fine solution and any player should only really make that mistake once, there are many many other mistakes players can make within the game too that would ruin their experience. You can't protect players from everything.

The decision is to not let a whole other group of players not have the option to find people to play with. Right now the only way to even find people to play a "live" but actually turned based-game, friendly mode. Means you would probabaly have to know each of the players who join your game. Since players looking for games in the turn-based lobby are most definitely not going to there looking to play a live game.

Since it is avialable for every other game I know and play I don't see why it can't be for TI4 where it would be very well suited as the game is kindo hard to play "competetively" anyway with the sheer about of randomness, inbalances etc. A friendly and relaxed way to play the game would make many games more enjoyable.

A suggestion can be created so players can vote on it. I can then check with BGA if the change will be allowed.

[EuroGamez]

Okay, I've made the suggestion here:

https://boardgamearena.com/bug?id=245012