I'm not saying the northern shoveler is a great card. It's one of the worst cards that gives you extra card draw. But it does give you extra card draw, which is the single most important thing at the start of the game. The more cards you draw, the more likely you are to find good ones.
Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
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Re: Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
It also give your opponent a card draw without them having to spend a turn drawing. If the card is good, you gave them a free turn basically. So all things being equal, it benefits them more.
When using the shoveler power you need to make sure you benefit more than your opponent, like if you have a tuck and lay and they don't or having +1 cards allows you to tuck and draw the remainder of the game. At the start of the game, you typically don't have enough information.
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FrankJones
- Posts: 2447
- Joined: 30 June 2024, 00:24
Re: Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
Post by FrankJones »
And the food cost. It's just brutal. Wilson's snipe is 5 points for ONE food. Northern Shoveler is 7 points for 3 food. I don't understand why two birds that do the exact same thing have such wildly different cost-to-points ratios. And yes, I realize the Northern shoveler has a larger nest for eggs. Big Whoop.
Re: Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
I appreciate the analysis. It was very in-depth and I thank you for giving your opinion on the cards.FrankJones wrote: ↑03 April 2026, 20:51 AND THEN YOU CONCEDED ?????????
WHY ???? Maybe your opponent had bad bonus cards. You're about to play the Painted bunting, which could give you a big bonus card, then lay eggs twice for big points and then play the Hermit thrush.
And you have one more turn remaining !!!!!
Look man, I don't know you, but maybe you try finishing your games instead of conceding close games ???
I just spent over an HOUR analyzing your game only to have you suddenly QUIT with 4 turns left???????
I am agitated beyond belief. This will be the last game of yours I ever waste my time analyzing again.
However, once he had the Whooping Crane, I knew it was over. The reason being was that he had points advantage, another drop for yet another bonus card, the Blue-winged Warbler for extra damage if needed, and was going to win the end-of-round goal anyway. The star nests were too much to overcome. I went back on the replay and calculated the end game points. No bonus card from the Painted Bounting would have given me the points needed to overcome the situation. The best I could have gotten was either 3 or 4 points (like from the the Wild food bonus, number of birds in a habitat, or the Geography bonus). So, maybe 10 pts at best for 3 bonus cards. He already had 7 pts due to the star nests (bowl shaped nest, 4 pts) and the fruit (3 pts). If he drew another bonus card that gave a bonus based on nest type, it was assuredly over. I would have lost no matter what. While the score could have possibly been close, it really didn't matter. He had too many points to overcome. What I was confused on was where I went wrong on my play, or blundered as you put it.
Now, you could say that I didn't know that for sure and I shouldn't have conceded. But the statistical odds of that happening were slim. I think even you know that. But I know your position on conceding in games, so I understand why you would say this.
Re: Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
Right. In most games, I worry so much about not getting into an early hole, that trying to prevent that often costs me games. I knew in this one, it was a potential sacrifice. But I wanted the forest birds because I had them in my hand and didn't want to rely on blind draws.illy831 wrote: ↑04 April 2026, 00:23 Yeah, I never like spotting an opponent 3 (or even 4) points but the first round is the one where it's most tolerable, or rather, sometimes you have to work so hard to avoid it that it's not worth it. Two forest birds is plenty and if an opponent is going to go for three, it's so unlikely I have a setup where it's sensible to match. So I think it's a reasonable to one to say "I'll play one or two depending on what works for me" — in the beginning, setting yourself up is more important.
But seeing what you and some other people have said, that was probably the better option.
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FrankJones
- Posts: 2447
- Joined: 30 June 2024, 00:24
Re: Why did I lose this game? What steps did I do wrong?
Post by FrankJones »
My position on conceding games was in relation to conceding at the end of an already-decided game when it would barely take any time to just finish and allow the end-game stats and scoring to be logged.
If my opponent wants to concede a game in which I could still lose, hey, go ahead. Even if there is a 1% chance, why throw away that 1 win out of 100?
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- ↳ River of Gold
- ↳ Concept
- ↳ Jump Gate
- ↳ Odicey
- ↳ Jokerball
- ↳ Koi-koi
- ↳ LUZ
- ↳ Samarkand
- ↳ Durak
- ↳ Wizards Cup
- ↳ Art Thief
- ↳ Cacao
- ↳ Kokeshi
- ↳ Coupell
- ↳ Lumen: The Lost World
- ↳ Go Fish
- ↳ Quetzal
- ↳ Golfie
- ↳ Tranquility
- ↳ Dédale
- ↳ Resolve
- ↳ Wizards of the Grimoire
- ↳ Envelopes of Cash
- ↳ Crisps
- ↳ Stalk exchange
- ↳ Sir Ocelot's cave
- ↳ Claim
- ↳ Shifting Stones
- ↳ Quarto
- ↳ Art Decko
- ↳ Age of Civilization
- ↳ Carnegie
- ↳ Mesos
- ↳ Hidden Leaders
- ↳ Yokai
- ↳ Battle of LITS
- ↳ Conspiracy
- ↳ Dice Hospital: ER – Emergency Roll
- ↳ Minnesota Whist
- ↳ Let's Catch the Lion!
- ↳ Luxor
- ↳ Forks: 2nd Edition
- ↳ Color Pop
- ↳ Kamon
- ↳ Scratch and Catch
- ↳ Bubblee Pop
- ↳ Qu4to
- ↳ Cephalopod
- ↳ Tablut
- ↳ 12 Chip Trick
- ↳ icecoldicehockey
- ↳ Cucumber
- ↳ German Whist
- ↳ Shogun
- ↳ Oriflamme
- ↳ Bower
- ↳ Verona Twist
- ↳ Balloon Pop!
- ↳ None Shall Pass!
- ↳ District Noir
- ↳ It's a Wonderful Kingdom
- ↳ Refuge
- ↳ Seikatsu
- ↳ Quadrata Canada
- ↳ Applejack
- ↳ The Itty Bitty Card Game
- ↳ Treos
- ↳ Kulami
- ↳ Happy City
- ↳ Paper World
- ↳ Coin Age
- ↳ Trailblazers
- ↳ Roll Into Town
- ↳ The Hanging Gardens
- ↳ Dungeon Rummy
- ↳ Road to 300
- ↳ Circle of Life
- ↳ Kingscraft
- ↳ Caper: Europe
- ↳ President
- ↳ Gomoku
- ↳ GoldnCrash
- ↳ Takara Island
- ↳ Sherlock 13
- ↳ Choconnect
- ↳ Mapmaker: The Gerrymandering Game
- ↳ The Jelly Monster Lab
- ↳ Pente
- ↳ Shut the Box
- ↳ Tiwanaku
- ↳ China Gold
- ↳ Ginkgopolis
- ↳ Mythicals the boardgame
- ↳ Seotda
- ↳ Dragon Castle
- ↳ Bug
- ↳ Bunny Drops
- ↳ Sfynx
- ↳ Classified Information
- ↳ Little Factory
- ↳ Metro
- ↳ Thurn and Taxis
- ↳ Cake Master
- ↳ Sneferu: Builders of the Pyramids
- ↳ Pocket Cats
- ↳ Orion Duel
- ↳ Propuh
- ↳ Piratas!
- ↳ Streetcar
- ↳ Mind Up!
- ↳ Blooms
- ↳ Diamonds
- ↳ The Last
- ↳ Con Sonar!
- ↳ Love Links
- ↳ Caravan
- ↳ Moon River
- ↳ Jekyll vs. Hyde
- ↳ Sergeant Major
- ↳ ECK
- ↳ Battlegammon
- ↳ Via Magica
- ↳ Expeditions: around the world
- ↳ Newton
- ↳ EKONOS
- ↳ Mexica
- ↳ 42
- ↳ Cosmos: Empires
- ↳ Architects of Amytis
- ↳ Tiny Turbo Cars
- ↳ Ekko
- ↳ Kami
- ↳ Karvi
- ↳ Crazy Farmers
- ↳ Masters of Renaissance: Lorenzo il Magnifico – The Card Game
- ↳ Siam
- ↳ Aniversus
- ↳ Uptown
- ↳ Kabaleo
- ↳ Qamgo
- ↳ Hex
- ↳ Nibble
- ↳ Medina
- ↳ Room 25
- ↳ Duck & Cover
- ↳ Simplicity
- ↳ Haggis
- ↳ Buttons
- ↳ Big Two
- ↳ Kahuna
- ↳ Hadara
- ↳ Ynaros Fallin
- ↳ Skate Legend
- ↳ Finca
- ↳ Calypso
- ↳ Bacon
- ↳ Age of Champagne
- ↳ Tulip & Rose
- ↳ L'Oracle B.A-BET
- ↳ Ultimate Tic-Tac-Toe
- ↳ Battle Spirits Saga
- ↳ Qawale
- ↳ Veletas
- ↳ GOLDblivion
- ↳ Zola
- ↳ Quirky Quarks
- ↳ 99 (trick-taking card game)
- ↳ Forbidden Island
- ↳ Elfenland
- ↳ Apocalypse au Zoo de Carson City
- ↳ High Season
- ↳ Flaming Pyramids
- ↳ Oxono
- ↳ Equinox
- ↳ Connect6
- ↳ Illustori
- ↳ Sahwari
- ↳ Dicy Cards
- ↳ Geek Out! Masters
- ↳ The Gnomes of Zavandor
- ↳ The Fox in the Forest
- ↳ Forever Home
- ↳ Neom
- ↳ SetUp
- ↳ Steam Works
- ↳ On Tour
- ↳ Spring Cleaning
- ↳ Ice and the Sky
- ↳ Zefiria
- ↳ Konane
- ↳ Homesteaders
- ↳ The King's Guild
- ↳ 3000 Scoundrels
- ↳ Florenza: The Card Game
- ↳ Thermopyles
- ↳ The Fox in the Forest: Duet
- ↳ Power Vacuum
- ↳ Vault A Den of Thieves
- ↳ Coal Baron
- ↳ Unrest
- ↳ Okanagan: Valley of the Lakes
- ↳ Nacho Pile
- ↳ Hack Trick
- ↳ That Time You Killed Me
- ↳ Sobek
- ↳ Yaniv
- ↳ Almadi
- ↳ Looot
- ↳ Romi Rami
- ↳ Battle Sheep
- ↳ Forage
- ↳ Batalla de Coronas
- ↳ Solar Storm
- ↳ Loco Momo
- ↳ Cardiceo
- ↳ GrumbleStone
- ↳ Trike
- ↳ Legendary Inventors
- ↳ Koryŏ
- ↳ That's Life!
- ↳ Lielow
- ↳ Dark Agent
- ↳ Wastelandia
- ↳ Flowers: A Mandala Game
- ↳ Solo Whist
- ↳ Copenhagen
- ↳ HUND
- ↳ Flip Freighters
- ↳ Sapiens
- ↳ Boreal
- ↳ Eminent Domain: Microcosm
- ↳ Maps of Misterra
- ↳ Micro Midgard
- ↳ All In
- ↳ OASIS New Hope
- ↳ Castles of Caleira
- ↳ Goblin Hood
- ↳ For the King (and Me)
- ↳ Starship Merchants
- ↳ Evergreen
- ↳ Boomerang: Australia
- ↳ Once Upon A Forest
- ↳ Megalomania
- ↳ Caribbean All Fours
- ↳ Cradle to Grave
- ↳ Le Roy des Ribauds
- ↳ Palace
- ↳ Dice Summoners
- ↳ Divercité
- ↳ The Battle for Hill 218
- ↳ Yokai Septet
- ↳ Astra
- ↳ Insert
- ↳ Niagara
- ↳ gaia
- ↳ Number Drop
- ↳ Rest In Peace
- ↳ Vidrasso
- ↳ Tic-Tac Match
- ↳ The Ruhr: A Story of Coal Trade
- ↳ United Square
- ↳ Noir: Killer versus Inspector
- ↳ Diced Tomatoes
- ↳ The Builders: Antiquity
- ↳ Meridians
- ↳ Barbu
- ↳ Dinosaur Tea Party
- ↳ Origin
- ↳ Exit Strategy
- ↳ Spirits of the Forest
- ↳ Boss Quest
- ↳ Expedition: Northwest Passage
- ↳ Through the Ages
- ↳ 24/7: The Game
- ↳ Whist 22
- ↳ Gift of Tulips
- ↳ Volfyirion Guilds
- ↳ Zuuli
- ↳ FIKA
- ↳ Don't Go In There
- ↳ Vaalbara
- ↳ Humanity
- ↳ Neutreeko
- ↳ Hawaii
- ↳ Xanadu
- ↳ Murus Gallicus
- ↳ Colorado
- ↳ The Mother Road: Route 66
- ↳ Secret Moon
- ↳ Diablo
- ↳ Nain Jaune
- ↳ HUGO
- ↳ Robots Ate Our Pizza
- ↳ I'm The Boss
- ↳ Empire Plateau: The Lateral Thinking Tactical Strategy Wargame
- ↳ Micro Dojo
- ↳ Ghost At Home
- ↳ Rift Valley Reserve
- ↳ Legend Raiders
- ↳ Betta
- ↳ Streets
- ↳ cucco
- ↳ Tumbleweed
- ↳ Crazy Eights
- ↳ Hypnosia
- ↳ Mia
- ↳ Crime Zoom: A Dirty Objective
- ↳ Oust
- ↳ Line It
- ↳ Crypt
- ↳ Silo
- ↳ Knockout Whist
- ↳ Legends of Hellas
- ↳ Las Vegan
- ↳ Raubbau
- ↳ Tucano
- ↳ Lifeline
- ↳ Rive
- ↳ Sensei
- ↳ Hungarian Tarokk
- ↳ Impasse
- ↳ Drones vs Seagulls
- ↳ Stir Fry Eighteen
- ↳ Trusis
- ↳ Gosu
- ↳ Look at the Stars
- ↳ Schrödinger's Cats
- ↳ Cubosaurs
- ↳ Canosa
- ↳ Hydroracers
- ↳ Yin Yang
- ↳ Fairy Trails
- ↳ Veggie Garden
- ↳ mow
- ↳ Chocolate Factory
- ↳ 8 Masters' Revenge
- ↳ Noah
- ↳ Amyitis
- ↳ Signorie
- ↳ Injawara
- ↳ Regidice
- ↳ Pedro
- ↳ Factum
- ↳ Kingdoms
- ↳ Baby Dinosaur Rescue
- ↳ Vege Tables
- ↳ Egocentric World
- ↳ EpiZodiak
- ↳ Blue Skies
- ↳ Fai-fo
- ↳ Sobek 2 players
- ↳ Senshi
- ↳ Big Monster
- ↳ Small Islands
- ↳ Lineae
- ↳ Mascarade
- ↳ Dragon Keeper: The Dungeon
- ↳ Icebreaker
- ↳ Yspahan
- ↳ Iwari
- ↳ Nicodemus
- ↳ Eruption
- ↳ Troyes Dice
- ↳ Morocco
- ↳ SteamRollers
- ↳ Blaze
- ↳ Madeira
- ↳ Exploration: Warzone
- ↳ Tea Time
- ↳ Zener
- ↳ Penalty Challenge
- ↳ EVL
- ↳ Lost Explorers
- ↳ Herrlof
- ↳ Turn the tide
- ↳ Off the Rails
- ↳ Krosmaster Blast
- ↳ Grand Bazaar
- ↳ Grosstarock
- ↳ Trick of the Rails
- ↳ Rolled West
- ↳ NXS
- ↳ Hoarders
- ↳ Saint Poker
- ↳ Bombay
- ↳ Nautilus
- ↳ Cinco
- ↳ Gopher
- ↳ The Void
- ↳ Metromania
- ↳ Guildes
- ↳ KQJ
- ↳ Phat
- ↳ Penny Press
- ↳ Quantik
- ↳ Mammalath
- ↳ Uncle Chestnut's Table Gype
- ↳ ToeShamBo
- ↳ Biyi
- ↳ Nanga Parbat
- ↳ Diam's
- ↳ Coup
- ↳ Gear & Piston
- ↳ GORami
- ↳ Dragon Line
- ↳ Outlaws: Last Man Standing
- ↳ Tiki
- ↳ Gygès
- ↳ Khronos
- ↳ Outlaws: Last Man Standing
- ↳ 13 Leaves
- ↳ 15 Days
- ↳ 15 Jours en France
- ↳ 5Pairs
- ↳ 62 Soleils d'Eté
- ↳ A Fistful of Gold
- ↳ APEX
- ↳ AVES
- ↳ Alakablast
- ↳ Amazonas
- ↳ Apocalypse au Zoo de Carson City
- ↳ Arabella
- ↳ Auntie Mildred's list of random tasks
- ↳ Aurum
- ↳ Bamboozle
- ↳ Battleships Pencil & Paper
- ↳ Bauer
- ↳ Bebop
- ↳ Bids
- ↳ Bizarre Manor
- ↳ Blast Radius
- ↳ Block Arena
- ↳ Blooms
- ↳ Blot
- ↳ Bug Off
- ↳ Bunny Boom
- ↳ CATsle Builder
- ↳ Cannonades
- ↳ Capybara'n'Capyabara
- ↳ Carcassonne
- ↳ Cassino
- ↳ Catatac
- ↳ Chandigarh
- ↳ Cheez-Tricks
- ↳ Churn
- ↳ Circle Of Life: on the Savannah
- ↳ Coffee
- ↳ Coins
- ↳ Coloretto
- ↳ Confusing Lands
- ↳ Cookie battle
- ↳ Crash
- ↳ Crash & Grab
- ↳ Crits & Tricks
- ↳ Custodian Dice
- ↳ Dance of Muses
- ↳ Deck EXPRESS: Tennessee Central
- ↳ Deck EXPRESS: Tennessee Central
- ↳ Deliverance
- ↳ Detective Poker
- ↳ Dickory
- ↳ Digging For Dinos
- ↳ Dobro
- ↳ Draft Cider
- ↳ Dragon Keeper, The Dungeon
- ↳ DragonOverload
- ↳ Dragonarium
- ↳ Enemy Anemone
- ↳ Eriantys
- ↳ Expressions
- ↳ Falconry
- ↳ Festi’vibes
- ↳ Fibonachos
- ↳ Fight the Landlord
- ↳ Finity
- ↳ Five Three Five
- ↳ Flockers
- ↳ Flume
- ↳ For-Ex
- ↳ Four Gardens
- ↳ Fox on the Tree
- ↳ GIPF
- ↳ Galactic Era
- ↳ Game of Trains
- ↳ Garden Nation
- ↳ Gems of Iridescia
- ↳ Get on Board: Paris & Roma
- ↳ Get the MacGuffin
- ↳ Go_sandboxversion
- ↳ Golems
- ↳ Good Fortune
- ↳ Gravity Superstar
- ↳ Greasy Spoon
- ↳ Group
- ↳ Grund
- ↳ Guile
- ↳ Gunsen
- ↳ Gyges
- ↳ Hacienda
- ↳ Hadron
- ↳ Hamsters vs Hippos
- ↳ Hawaiian Hanafuda
- ↳ Heckin Hounds
- ↳ Herooj
- ↳ Hey! That's my fish
- ↳ Hypnosia
- ↳ Hội Phố (Second Edition)
- ↳ Isaac
- ↳ Kaiser
- ↳ Kani Nari Ebi
- ↳ Khiva
- ↳ Khronos
- ↳ Kinapa
- ↳ Kmakici Family's greatest teatime
- ↳ Knister
- ↳ Kraken Up
- ↳ Les toits de Paris
- ↳ Lewis & Clark
- ↳ Livingstone
- ↳ Logger
- ↳ Lunar
- ↳ Maatatahay
- ↳ Malabares
- ↳ Mango
- ↳ Mattock
- ↳ Meadow
- ↳ Metz
- ↳ Mighty
- ↳ Minefield
- ↳ Minhwatu
- ↳ Mod Ten
- ↳ Monster Factory
- ↳ Monster Hex
- ↳ Monster Smash
- ↳ Moolight: The Land of the Wolves
- ↳ Mutant Crops
- ↳ Nap
- ↳ Narabi
- ↳ Natural Chaos
- ↳ Neon Reign
- ↳ Nylon-ppong
- ↳ ONE
- ↳ Olenon
- ↳ Onda
- ↳ Open Season
- ↳ Paikō
- ↳ Palourde
- ↳ Park Life
- ↳ Penny Press
- ↳ Persona Non Grata
- ↳ Pescado Novo
- ↳ Piepmatz
- ↳ Pier 18
- ↳ Piles!
- ↳ Pirates Under Fire
- ↳ Pondscape
- ↳ Pook
- ↳ Positano
- ↳ Puerto Rico
- ↳ Quest Inc.
- ↳ Quiltable
- ↳ Quinque
- ↳ Quintus
- ↳ Race for the Galaxy
- ↳ Redstone
- ↳ Relative Space
- ↳ Roppyakken
- ↳ Rowdy Partners
- ↳ Rumble Planet
- ↳ Safari Witness
- ↳ Sasaki
- ↳ Savanna Ten
- ↳ Scratch and Catch
- ↳ Scream Park
- ↳ Sea Shells
- ↳ Seven Knights Bewitched
- ↳ Sheep Boom Bah
- ↳ Shokoba
- ↳ Skirmish: Battle for Draconia
- ↳ Slambo
- ↳ Snorkeling
- ↳ Sobek 2 players
- ↳ Soothsayers
- ↳ Soulaween
- ↳ Spellcrafter
- ↳ Splitter
- ↳ Squadro
- ↳ Stigméria
- ↳ Stonks
- ↳ Strategic Reserve
- ↳ Strawberry Sunset
- ↳ Sunrise Sunset
- ↳ Suspeição
- ↳ Tapas
- ↳ The Battle for Hill 218
- ↳ The Great American Fox Hunt
- ↳ The Great Split
- ↳ The King of the Woods
- ↳ The Little Flower Shop
- ↳ The Nine Domains
- ↳ Tholos
- ↳ Thrive
- ↳ Tien Len
- ↳ Time Splicers
- ↳ Tiny Farms
- ↳ Toepen
- ↳ Tomatoss
- ↳ TriATri
- ↳ Trickarus
- ↳ Troggu
- ↳ Twin Palms
- ↳ Two-Ten-Jack
- ↳ Unane
- ↳ Up or Down?
- ↳ Vegetable Stock
- ↳ Verdant Arizona
- ↳ Via Gladiola
- ↳ Vizia
- ↳ Waddle
- ↳ Wana
- ↳ Whist
- ↳ Wolf and Sheep
- ↳ Word Traveler
- ↳ Xxung
- ↳ Yokai Pagoda
- ↳ Yoxii
- ↳ Zookeepers
- ↳ texasbingo
- ↳ Àiyé
- ↳ Écarté